A few months ago I was reading old posts on here about welding and came away with the impression that mig welding was the way to go for diy welding. Since then I've started an evening class at a local college and spent several weeks practicing with a mig but used a stick welder for the first time tonight.
Tbh, I found the stick a lot easier than the mig so I'm just wondering what the pro's and cons of each method are, especially for working outside (no garage etc) and for doing bodywork repairs with thin steel.
Is it just a case of personal preference, or are there some very good reasons for sticking with mig?
Tony
Looking for: window apertures for side windows, at the back of the van
T25; 1985; RHD; 1.9DG petrol / LPG; white Autosleeper high-top; Looking rusty again!
Stick welding tends to blow holes in thin steel and so it isnt really used for welding body panels. It is easier but a lot more work in the long run.
Mig is designed for thinner metals and wire work and can provide a much better weld when using these materials than stick welding, providing you don't run out of gas!
Mark.
I'm Not A Complete Idiot... Some Bits Are Missing!
Mocki wrote:you only blow holes with stick welding if you cant weld with stick......proper mans welding that
not like that girlie MIG stuff.......
Ah, that'll explain why I found the stick a lot easier!
Seriously though, can bodywork be done ok with a stick? I forgot to mention that all the stuff we've done at college so far has been on pieces of plate, 6mm thick.
Tony
Looking for: window apertures for side windows, at the back of the van
T25; 1985; RHD; 1.9DG petrol / LPG; white Autosleeper high-top; Looking rusty again!
Mocki wrote:yeah, it can be done, but you got to be good, very good, and its loads harder, and you need loads more prep, and heatsinking equipment....
my ole chap welded a complete floor pan in a rover p4 with a arc welder when i was a kid, took a couple of weekends iirc, but it was mot'd after
I am an "old Chap" and I spent years mending old vehicles with an arc welder. My method of achieving continous welding on thin body panels was to use a variable transformer "Variac" to control the incoming mains voltage. I would strike up on the most appropriate setting then as soon as I started the run I would have my assistant (SWIMBO) turn the variac down to a preset mark - about 60% - whereupon I had a good chance of not blowing holes. Another way is to stich it together then fill in the gaps moving about so as not to cause too much local heat. Arc welding body panels is a nightmare however and even a cheap <£100 MIG leaves arc standing even with pub gas. MIG doesn't tolerate dirty metal though and for best local cleaning I find a 1/2 inch Power File best (B & D for instance)
Cheers
Smiffy
Well-timed silence hath more eloquence than speech.
"A quiet shy boy who took little part in games or sport"
88 High top 2.1 WBX
Laurie wrote:I'm glad you're taking a course. Loads of people go at it without preparation or understanding of personal safety. (Me included initially)
You only need one dose of 'arc eye' to highlight the personal safety aspect. Goggle up
Oh yes! I forgot to say that after many years of struggling and a couple of bad attacks of arc eye a couple of years ago I bought an automatic face mask. Super gadget and well worth the money.
Cheers
Well-timed silence hath more eloquence than speech.
"A quiet shy boy who took little part in games or sport"
88 High top 2.1 WBX
Whilst I'm not bad at welding me'sen, my Mr Other Half is the dog's nads ASME 9 coded and head-hunted from one end of the country to the other. Mig is better - particularly for continuous runs and good, even penetration. Less warping of the metal too.
A good mask does help but also consider the crap you're breathing in and make sure any bare skin is covered - otherwise you'll be sporting a dodgy tan - particularly in a little 'v' shape on yer neck.
Debby
Apparently a spades' a spade - until yer start diggin' - then it's a pain in the a***.... Ho Hmmm!!!!! Or is that Hi Hoooo!!!!! http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=YosMFeq6rRU" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
TIG is good but the gear is much more expensive and it's more difficult - a two-handed job like the old gas welding.
Stick welding is near-impossible on car bodywork - not impossible because I've done it, but you need thin electrodes and low current. There is also the issue of slag (and its removal) with stick welding; you don't really want to be hammering at your newly-welded panels!
I stick-weld heavy steel, like my trailer, because I can get more current and hence better penetration (my MIG set isn't quite beefy enough for that), and it's almost unheard of for my welds to break.
But on car bodies it's MIG all the way; just so much more convenient (you really don't want to be changing a stick under your car!), neater, less likely to blow holes... and I've welded a lot of cars!
Unless you're welding 16 swg or greater (> 1.5mm ) I'd not use stick welding unless you've years of experience which isn't likely these days..
Did a lot of gas welding as a youf, but MIG actually took me a year or more to get to grips with, as I found few would tell you what really mattered... power settings and wire feeds.
Gas and type of gas makes a big difference, recently discoevred what no-one would tell me, that using Argon or Argom mixes, requires about half the power than using CO2...
Look on the Wiki and you'll find a MIG wire-feed speed calculator... might be of some use.
I've got a Clarke 155TE I think it is, it's good (£175). Hobby bottles of CO2 or Argon Mix from Halfords are great, the pub bottle is a hassle (weight and piping hassles)
Recently I've been using Stainless wire a lot doing stainless work, and leave it in for mild steel, as I find its welds a lot easier, even welded up my brother's cement mixer drum last year, and for the first time he says, it hasn't started cracking again within a few months.. maybe a more ductile weld!
Auto-darkening helmets..
Get one! Horner are the best, but just check the specs and spend £50 upwards to get a reasonable one.. an investment !
Your teacher instructor is wise to introduce you to stick welding, to give you a broad intoruduction to electric/arc welding, and you can use it... but listen to every word he says on MIG welding, and practice practice practice (a torch held in-line with gun itself when welding under the van can be very useful... the biggest problem is seeinga ctually what is going on in the weld pool)... with Argon and right power setting, rusty(ish) thin metal can be welded, keep wire brushing as you go to make fresh metal available...
There are some good video tutorials on the web... its all about the sizzle sound !
Goggle up
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