No starting going on whatsoever!

[purplechugster]

Up at 6am this morning to drive from london to devon, first time the other 'alf has been able to come with me for months..... and so (for the first time ever) the van wont start

Turn the key, wait a moment or two, turn the key to start - nothing. Not a squeak from the starter motor.

I used the van last week without any problems - but there was the occasional glitch when starting. First try, nothing happened (at all), second try would start fine, although Im sure I heard a 'sktchhhh' noise like a short circuit coming from the engine compartment several times.

So where to start?

The battery seems fine, Ive cleaned up the connections etc, Ive checked the fuses (I think). What to look at next?


The other possible problem (this might be nothing to do with it, so dont get too hung up on it!) is what might (?) be a cut-out switch. There's a switch near the zig unit, and a similar one under a wheel arch which look to me like an over-ride cutout switch, but they dont seem to do anything. There's a loose (red) wire which comes from this circuit (I think) into the battery compartment, but I dont think its ever been attached to anything. Now, this probably is irrelevant (its always been there, the vans always worked before) but it makes tracing wires etc all a bit tricky. It looks like a chimp with some wire cutters has been playing around with the engine electrics


So - hints please.
Lets start with obvious stuff and hope I can still get away on holiday today... then we'll move onto the holiday cancelled/throwing money at the van/dead van outside my flat for weeks type stuff



(At least club80-90 is a familiar home to come and cry in. You've all been there)

[Mocki]

first thing to do is pop under it and see if the signal wire is still connected tothe starter motor, its the thinner red/black wire that used to end in a spade connector, this is common, the connector either falls off, or just disconnects due to corrosion and vibration.

Second thing to do is check the main lead to the starter, this also corrodes, and a "wiggle" normally finds that it was a bad connection, or
the starter signal isnt getting from the key switch, again, a "wiggle" of the key sometimes resolves this, and if so a new switch is in order......

feel free to ring me if you need "on the spot help" via the telephonic network as you crawl around getting grunted at for still no being on holiday.

[purplechugster]

Thanks for that, you're a star


Okay, progress of a sort. Not sure how though....

I took the battery out and gave it a charge (wasnt fully charged, but wasnt flat either. Took less than an hour to re-charge). I wiggled all the wires and scratched my head a lot.

Then (hurrah) it started.... after a pause of nothing happening and a sktchhh of short circuit. Second attempt when the mrs was dragged out of bed (for the second time today) to start it, I could see a puff of smoke from the starter motor.

So presumably a short circuit or dodgy connection somewhere?
Or is this the starter motor's way of saying farewell?

The plan now is to set off with crossed fingers and if it goes wrong then force the RAC man to work out whats wrong....

[toomanytoys]

If the starter gave a puff of smoke, I would suggest taking it off and getting it checked.. sounds like the solenoid has died...
either replace the complete starter unit or just the solenoid (if you can find one)..

[Dan Wood]

My van has similar symptoms this week. (It comes and goes you see...)

Holding the key in position for a few seconds sometimes wakes it up. Other than that a few sharp blows to the solenoid with a nearby rock usually works!

I'll get it fixed one day, but it has months where it works perfectly and I don't do unnecessary work!

[airhead]

Mine does this too, but all I hear from the engine bay is the auxilliary water pump (I think. Either that or the turbo cooling fan) spinning. Sometimes it will work, other times its a case of trying and trying until it does. Another thing on the to do list. I think its the signal wire. My recommendation is, put your hand on the motor when someone else turns the key (make sure its out of gear!) and see if anywhere gets warm or hot and see if you can feel or hear a clunk from it. That might be a good pointer as to where the problem lies.

[MacAoidh]

And park on a hill. And carry a tow-rope (for powered bump starts)

My mum's morris minor had something like this, so she always carried a wooden mallet in the glove compartment.

My morris minor had a slightly different problem, so I always started it with the cranking handle. Such a fabulous option! How would a retro fit go on a van?

[purplechugster]

Morning all

Im back from a few days surfing in devon (top waves. I'm a bit worn out today)

Having got the van to devon (we drove all the way there without stopping the engine) it stopped and started several times with no problems.... right until we were in the town centre car park

A quick call to the RAC (who turned up in less than half an hour. Good stuff) and he got it going 'with a wiggle'. He did some "stuff" and his diagnosis was a dead/dying solenoid so time for a new starter motor. And wiggling for the time being

[airhead]

Dead solenoid for a modern "fitter" type mechanic who doesnt fix parts, just replaces them. Try rebuilding the motor and solenoid. I bet you it will be fine after a bit of strategic greasing, sanding, new brushes and a good clean.

As for the starting handle idea, I always liked the idea of that on a modern vehicle. I mean, we carry spare wheels! Why not the option of a starting handle as well? Id say it would probably be difficult to implement on diesel engines given the glowplugs need power and the fuel cutoff solenoid might not disengage without a certain amount of power from a battery. Probably would work a lot easier on a petrol van.