3-point seatbelt mounting for +2 cab seat

[silverbullet]

I have been giving a bit of thought to this subject, with a view to getting a prototype made and then a production run.

The problem for anyone with a double cab passenger seat is the centre lap belt, which for those with small kids is a cause for concern in the 21st century.

The double seat back is not of very strong construction when compared to the single, so the inertia reel mounting needs to be well designed to prevent the large forces involved in a crash from basically crushing the seat back and also the occupant.

My idea is to make a suitably robust tube bracket from CDS (aka rollcage tube) that will fit around the seat, mount the inertia reel suitably high (between the headrests) and clear half-, full- and non-bulkhead equipped vans.
LHD and RHD versions would be available.

The question is: would you be interested in such a product? Safety doesn't come cheap as we all know from the price of seatbelts but this is something that needs to be addressed urgently imho, given the rising popularity of these vans.

[ELVIS]

Going back to last week and the whole bull bar/bumper debate. Where does it leave you litigation wise using anything other than oe if someone decides your seatbelt mount/ design caused the end of the world? Don't have the first idea about rules and regs but presumeably woven in there is rather expensive crash testing fees.
There will always be one person wanting to rod you for a few quid.

[slippy8v]

As i have already just gone do this route and taking your advise i would be interested in what you have planned, I have a half bulk head and the syncro is RHD the inertia reel needs to be on the right side for the centre pax as i can the use the original mounts.
any thing is better than the lap belt.

[silverbullet]

Elvis. A carefully written disclaimer sheet, previously published and included with sale would be top of the list. "Supplimentary safety device" is how I would describe it.

Anyone seen or requested a materials spec and test data for their seatbelt bolts or retaining plates? Coded and tested welding?
People modifying Vito seats to fit just for the seatbelts??
Obviously a MIRA crash test programme is out of the question...

I appreciate the concern, but given some of the iffy lash-ups that are cropping up and/or being suggested (no offence intended slippy) a more engineered solution is needed.

My revised concept (fast evolving) is to mount the reel on the seat/battery box (reinforcing plate needed) and the belt to pass up and over the mount (putting the vertical component in compression) and the whole thing to pick up on the original seatbelt mounting points, plus one more.

So basically 2 holes to drill with reinforcers in the seat base and thats the extent of the mods to the bodyshell.

There is a break in the chain of liability afaics, because this would be a user-fit part. There is no way I am going into the seat belt fitting business!

[axeman]

This has to be the way forward for the 2 cab seat. The lap belt is just not adiquate these days.

Neil

[what2do]

I thought this could be done using the spreader plates with captive nuts that are available from Brickwerks. They enable a retractor to be fastened to the bulk head. Not looked too deeply into it so I may be missing something vitally important.

[silverbullet]

On a full bulkhead it may be possible, but given their rarity I couldnt say for certain. If a window is fitted then there would be no suitable mounting area for the reel anyway.

[what2do]

Here's a question for you. I've got a full bulk head with a small window in it, the other day I saw a pic on our favourite social media page that showed a full bulk head with a large window in it. I've never seen the large version before, have you encountered them? (Question is open to all!!)

[itchyfeet]

You don't want a large window or people may see you with your gag on

[Simon Baxter]

It is a bit of a niggle every year for us, our insurance company wants to know exactly how many of the seatbelt brackets we've sold.
We did have our bracket independently tested and it far exceeded the test, it's a little over engineered if anything.
We also now have laser cut plates made to the same design as the originals for rear seat belt installs into panel vans.

[what2do]

Sadly, I'm too much of a retard to import images from Facebook but the installation I saw mounted the retractor at about shoulder height (Middle seat) by drilling a hole in the bulkhead and fastening it to one of the a aw spreader plates. Despite lack of pics, does this sound ok to you lot? I know the bulkhead is a large panel but it is corrugated as well as having the rail which the seat upright fastens to, thus, it must have some inherent strength - is it sufficient though?

[silverbullet]

If the reel is on the bulkhead it's far too low. As the occupant moves forward in an impact, the belt is locked (so it has a fixed length) therefore the span across the chest and shoulder has to become shorter as the lap portion lengthens. This is from where the risk of spinal injury stems. The belt run has to rise significantly from the shoulder to be safe.

FWIW Even the middle reel in our 54 Vito is mounted barely high enough on the seat back if you are over 6'