Won't start and run without depressing the acc pedal

[Dan_T25]

Hi all,

I am having a slight issue with our van (1982 Aircooled 2ltr).

I ran the van around for an hour or so on Boxing Day after it was stood for a couple weeks, all was fine, it started and drove absolutely great. Today I moved the van so I could clean it, I left it running for a while whilst I got bits ready, after an hour and a half I went to move it back but it wouldn't start.

Trying to turn it over and no jump of life, only depressing the accelerator pedal would result in the engine firing but with a misfire, it sounds like its running on 2/3 cylinders? As soon as I took my foot off the accelerator the battery light would flicker and the van would instantly cut out, stinking of fuel, as if it's starved of fuel?

I always follow a start procedure, although after researching this today, it appears I was misinformed by the previous owner about the auto choke and usually depress the accelerator fully with the ignition on rather than before...

I've have had a root around in the engine bay, all seems connected, no leaks or split pipes, ht leads and cap seem ok. Only concern was that some spark plugs could be giggled in my finger tips and weren't as solid as expected. But is this normal? The leads are solid on top of the plugs though.

Is there anything I've missed or is it just flooded from when I moved it today; however would this cause a misfire and then stall?

Still getting used to VW mechanicals, I've done a search and looked on wiki, but not sure I'm suffering the same due to it running when the accelerator is wide open.

E D I T: just a thought - could my cleaning caused the issue? Could I have made something damp underneath? I was careful around the air intakes....

Thanks,
Dan

[Dan_T25]

Not looking good...

Just been out to start it, it's chucked a load of oil out of the exhaust...

I assume this is terminal?

[BOXY]

Don't panic just yet. If it's stinking of fuel, one or more of the plugs isn't firing. By turning the engine over without it firing you've managed to flood it and the "oil" out the exhaust is the petrol washing the carbon & oil out from the cylinder(s). Take the plugs out, clean & re-gap them. And then check they are all firing before you refit them.

As far as starting an air-cooled van goes, it doesn't matter if you set the chokes with the ignition on or off because they are set mechanically. You can check they are working by taking the air-box off and watching the flaps as you push the throttle link rod in the engine bay.

With a cold engine press the accelerator full down & release. (This sets the chokes). Start the engine. Let it run until the RPM starts to rise. Blip the throttle to knock the chokes off & the engine should idle as normal.

With a hot engine you don't need to set the chokes. The engine should fire just on the key. If it doesn't, I find holding the throttle full down as you turn it over gets it running. Obviously release the throttle as soon as it fires.

[Dan_T25]

Don't panic just yet. If it's stinking of fuel, one or more of the plugs isn't firing. By turning the engine over without it firing you've managed to flood it and the "oil" out the exhaust is the petrol washing the carbon & oil out from the cylinder(s). Take the plugs out, clean & re-gap them. And then check they are all firing before you refit them.

As far as starting an air-cooled van goes, it doesn't matter if you set the chokes with the ignition on or off because they are set mechanically. You can check they are working by taking the air-box off and watching the flaps as you push the throttle link rod in the engine bay.

With a cold engine press the accelerator full down & release. (This sets the chokes). Start the engine. Let it run until the RPM starts to rise. Blip the throttle to knock the chokes off & the engine should idle as normal.

With a hot engine you don't need to set the chokes. The engine should fire just on the key. If it doesn't, I find holding the throttle full down as you turn it over gets it running. Obviously release the throttle as soon as it fires.

Cheers Boxy - you've set some confidence in me that I've not knackered it.

I will dive into this tomorrow. I will keep you posted.

[Dan_T25]

I am going to attack this today and my thoughts are to replace the spark plugs, whilst I get the old ones out. Also I've realised I have no tools to do this...

Also looking at the wiki I see it states "2.0 eng cu cv 79-82 NGK B6ES" for mine as a reference. Only halfrauds is available around me at the drop of a hat so looking at these:

NGK 01 Spark Plug (x4) BP6ES:

http://www.halfords.com/webapp/wcs/stor ... yId_165736" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

As well as this kit:

http://www.halfords.com/webapp/wcs/stor ... yId_255216" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

But my confusion is to ensure I get the right socket to get them on and off....14mm ok?

Cheers,
Dan

[Dan_T25]

Think I am answering my own question here...21mm socket?

Think I will leave the spark plug replacement today and order some off the JK site. I will go for a remove, clean and regap.

[Dan_T25]

Well all plugs out, cleaned and regapped.

No.3 was pretty wet on the end, so I think this is the cylinder that is flooded. I couldn't check the spark on all as the wife has buggered off with the kids so I working on my own.....is there a trick around this?

Cut a long story short I am still at square one.

I believe it needs new plugs,leads and a cap. But is there anyway to over come the flooded camber at least so I can move it?

[Dan_T25]

Just read this on wiki (main site):

"The conventional remedy on a carbureted engine is to steadily hold the throttle wide open (full throttle) while cranking (starting) the engine. This permits the maximum flow of air through the engine, flushing the excess fuel out the exhaust"

[Dan_T25]

Just repeated my steps, van runs but only when throttle is open. Still chucking burnt excess out the back - but not as bad as before...

I've noticed that the carb on the right (when looking above from in side i.e. On the passenger side) the butterfly flap doesn't move at all? It is stuck in the closed position. Tried pushing it lightly and it's firm. The drivers side, my left as I look down, is slightly open and easy to move.

Is this correct? It would maybe explain why only cylinders 3 and 4 are flooded? No air getting in hence more fuel?????

[BOXY]

When you're standing looking at the choke flaps, push the throttle bar forward a smidge, and then try to move the flap. Moving the throttle bar should un-latch the chokes so you can move them both easily with your finger.
When the ignition is switched on there is a 12V supply to each choke body ( a spade connector) this heats up the coil slowly opening the choke flaps. Check you've got 12v at both the connectors by bridging a bulb between the spade & the terminal or use a multi-meter. If you have you should be able to watch the choke slowly open once you've un-latched them using the throttle. If the choke doesn't move you can disable them by loosening the three screws that hold the body and rotating the body until the flap is pointing straight up. Mark your starting position first so you can go back to it when you set the chokes up properly.

[Dan_T25]

When you're standing looking at the choke flaps, push the throttle bar forward a smidge, and then try to move the flap. Moving the throttle bar should un-latch the chokes so you can move them both easily with your finger.
When the ignition is switched on there is a 12V supply to each choke body ( a spade connector) this heats up the coil slowly opening the choke flaps. Check you've got 12v at both the connectors by bridging a bulb between the spade & the terminal or use a multi-meter. If you have you should be able to watch the choke slowly open once you've un-latched them using the throttle. If the choke doesn't move you can disable them by loosening the three screws that hold the body and rotating the body until the flap is pointing straight up. Mark your starting position first so you can go back to it when you set the chokes up properly.

Thanks Boxy - I managed to free it off by doing exactly what you have described in your first paragraph. As soon as I managed to free it off I tried the ignition again and the van jumped into life. And kept running

It runs really smooth now. Although my little experience has given me a kick up the bum to get it set up right as it obviously running rich. The right carb, as mentioned above, it is poor condition and needs a service/check over. The flaps have a build up on them compared to the other clean left side. So along with the plugs, leads and caps this should see the van in tip top for the spring - only 8 weeks to March after all.

I took it for a spin to run off the fuel/oil/carbon mix in the exhaust, I left a nice haze of blue behind me for a while but after 10mins it was gone.

Thanks for your pointers much appreciated.