Internal water pump switch

[Retro82]

Hi everyone , went out last night to check the water pump switch in the panel above the fridge with a multimeter, which was fine, went back out this morning to drive the bus and I have no electrics at all? All fuses are correct the leisure battery is running because the internal lights work , just nothing when I turn the ignition key and no instruments on the dash? Please help I'm confused

[AdrianC]

Hi everyone , went out last night to check the water pump switch in the panel above the fridge with a multimeter, which was fine, went back out this morning to drive the bus and I have no electrics at all? All fuses are correct the leisure battery is running because the internal lights work , just nothing when I turn the ignition key and no instruments on the dash? Please help I'm confused

You've checked the starter battery's not flat, yep?

[Retro82]

The battery which is under the drivers seat was flat just charged it an hour an gone out and the dash warning lights have come on but not enough charge to turn the engine over? That's fair enough another confusion is that everything seems to be wired to the battery under the seat for the engine and not a lot on the leisure battery , stereo water pump etc,, why would you anyone do that? No wonder the battery is flat

[ghost123uk]

Re-wiring internal accessories to the Leisure battery (and checking the split charging) is just one of those pleasant little jobs to do on a warm sunny day As it is it should not flatten your battery as the water pump only uses power when pumping and the stereo should not flatten A GOOD battery unless left un-driven for several days or even weeks (depending on the type of stereo, some use more power (even when off) than others).

How often / how far daily do you use the van at this time of year ?

A test of the starter battery might be a good idea. Let us know if you want info on "how to"

[Retro82]

Well we've had trouble since we had it , the battery indicator is saying the battery is ok, but there does seem to a constant drain or the bus isn't recharging the battery under the seat? Yes how do u check the starter battery? I haven't done much electrical work for a long time .. Thank you

[ghost123uk]

OK, I just thought, I did not ask you if this van is petrol or Diesel ? From your description I guess petrol, but best to be sure before we continue...

Diesel powered vans have their "main" starter battery in the engine bay whereas petrol ones have it behind the drivers seat (assuming RHD).

Next question = do you own one of those digital multimeters (like from Maplins for around £10) ?

Let me (us) know the answers to those 2 questions and I (we) will post the "how to".

[Retro82]

Yes 1.9 petrol with lpg conversion. And yes I have a very good multimeter :]

[ghost123uk]

OK, first fire the van up. Let it tick over for a few minutes (or just drive it as usual) then, whilst the motor is running, check the voltage on the main battery (under the seat) it should read between 13.6 to 14.2. If it does (and nearer 14 volts is better) then it means the van charging (alternator) is working.

You can do the above test on the Leisure battery in the same manner, to check the "split charging system" is working.

Then charge the main battery with a domestic charger over night. Then turn off the charger, leave the battery for an hour and measure the voltage. It should be around 12.9V (the higher the better). Then leave the battery (off the van) for around 8 hours or more and measure it again, if it has dropped much lower than 12.5 volts then it is not in good nick.

Remember it is very bad for any battery (well almost any battery that "we" come across) to be flattened
In fact letting it drop much below around 11.5 volts is not at all good for them (main battery and leisure battery).
Also note that even if your leisure battery has "deep cycle" written on it, it does NOT mean it is OK to "deep discharge" it (misleading wording in my opinion !)

Let us know...

[AdrianC]

The battery which is under the drivers seat was flat just charged it an hour an gone out and the dash warning lights have come on but not enough charge to turn the engine over? That's fair enough another confusion is that everything seems to be wired to the battery under the seat for the engine and not a lot on the leisure battery , stereo water pump etc,, why would you anyone do that? No wonder the battery is flat

What conversion is it? If you're saying "starter under driver's seat", I'm guessing it's not a Westy, since the starter's under the passenger seat on LHD vans.

An hour isn't going to charge a flat battery - if it's a 75Ah battery, and a 6A charger (random but typical), then it's going to take over 12hrs to fully charge from total flat... I'm sure it's not totally flat-flat, and you don't need to get it 100%, but you get the idea...

Remember that most vans didn't have the original van wiring touched when they were converted to campers - just added to - and the original van wiring includes radio & interior lights.

[Retro82]

It's a caravelle I have no idea which conversion it is I am completely new to these vehicles and bought simply as an experience and good easy vehicle to work on , or basic mechanics apart from the lpg which is whole new system for me as well. I just don't understand why the previous owners spent hundreds of pounds on a very good electrical job on a split charging system and not run much off it he's had the vehicles for 4 years ? Something seems to be running the battery down I don't know if he had this persistent problem but hey that's my fault finding task now !

[ghost123uk]

Battery drain (if present) is not hard to trace. Remove the -ve connector off the battery, connect a small 12V bulb via a bit of wire (soldered on) between the -ve connector and the -ve terminal of the battery. If that bulb lights, you have a drain. The brighter it lights the bigger the drain. (tip = make sure the doors are closed or the courtesy light will make the bulb glow !) Now remove fuses or disconnect accessories until the light goes out, at that point you have found the cause of the drain. Instead of that small bulb, you could use your meter, carefully, set to read Amps, set to 5 or 10 Amp setting, NOT any of the Milliamp settings as that could blow the fuse or circuit in the meter If using a meter, anything up to 100 Milliamps is considered OK (well be me anyway )

Modern radios "memory" wire (usually yellow) can cause a drain on the battery, also alarm systems.

Once again though, unless this drain is significantly high, or you leave the van un-used for a week or more, it should not be an issue. I would say that 90% of the time issues like this turn out to be a failing battery (assuming a stable running voltage of greater than 13.6 volts is present, pref 14 volts)

[Retro82]

Charged the battery full for 14 hours checked across the terminals and it was reading 13.2v I attached to the bus and let the engine warm up for a while idling the battery was reading 12.6 I then put all the instruments on in the dash with stereo and it s reading 12.2 v. Which to me sounds low but ok?

[AdrianC]

Charged the battery full for 14 hours checked across the terminals and it was reading 13.2v I attached to the bus and let the engine warm up for a while idling the battery was reading 12.6 I then put all the instruments on in the dash with stereo and it s reading 12.2 v. Which to me sounds low but ok?

OK, you're getting 12.6v no load, 12.2v load - but can you clarify if that's with the engine idling, or with the engine switched off after idling for a while?

What voltage are you seeing with the engine held at 2000rpm?

Unless that's 14v or so, the van's not charging.

[Retro82]

That's just idling ill check again at half throttle no rev counter on the bus? So it has to be up at 14v or its not charging? Will I need to recondition my alternator?

[AdrianC]

That's just idling ill check again at half throttle no rev counter on the bus?

Doesn't need to be "half throttle" or revving the nadgers off it - just a chunk above idle. 2k isn't that fast. You'll just need to crack the throttle open a bit.

So it has to be up at 14v or its not charging?

Yep. At idle, the alternator doesn't put out much output at all. Once it is putting something out, then you want that charging voltage around 14v. Too little, the battery won't take much charge. Too much, the battery will boil.

Will I need to recondition my alternator?

Quite possibly just a set of brushes.