wbx syncro engine crank seal query

[silverbullet]

As I am getting stuck into this inpromptu DG part-rebuild I noticed that the crank nose seal is actually a 2wd one and probably original. Not a surprise since this '86 MY has a variety of 2wd details. Seems they were still designing it all at Graz as the first ones rolled off the line!
Question is: which seal is the syncro one as ETKA says use either /or...?
It's got a steel single pulley if that makes any difference.

[toomanytoys]

Syncro "sand seal" is a double lipped afair and you need the ring on the pully for it to work.. IIRC they went obsolete... or the metal ring did...

they also cost a lot more..

I'll take a pic of mine this weekend..

[Russel]

I have a brand new one. Cost me £50.00 4 years ago in SA. If you want you can have it for the same.
Russel

[silverbullet]

A pony for a little lip seal? I'll have to think about that one - no offence, but I'll be on the phone to my bearing suppliers for a chat first.
I can make a ground adaptor ring for it to run on if I've got the relevant seal, no problem.
I'd hoped that someone would have just said that it's "this number, not that one" but it's never that simple is it?

[syncroandy]

FWIW ETOS lists the two parts (the bit on the crankcase and the bit on the pulley) as follows:

025 105 248 A Radial shaft seal £22.93 (plus VAT)
025 105 249 A Radial shaft seal £15.73 (plus VAT)

Also, on Patricks van the tinware had been cut away under the pulley, leading to more mud in the area. Probably worth ensuring the tinware's all present and correct IMO. It's Syncro-specific as well.

[silverbullet]

I take it that's what you got in for Patrick's engine then Andy?
£46.39 inc. vat for the combo, on my doorstep from TPS if there's still some stock... Any other seal that size would be about a fiver from our stockist, but I'd be up against a minimum order charge.
Of course If I had the seal dimensions, I could order 10 at a time

Tinware all present and correct. I've got a spare syncro set that I will get re-plated sometime. Eventually.

[Aidan]

just be thankful they are still available, the pulley one is basically a speedi sleeve in two planes with a double lipped seal built inside and the one that goes in the block is quadlipped internal and external sealing faces, because the pulley one has a thickness of it's own it takes the corresponding mating seal out of the normal size range, 47.17mm instead of 48mm , they are made by Goetse and you will find that they are unique to this application, who else but VW would decide to dunk a T3 in mud and decide that really the original 2wd oil seal wasn't up to the job so they'd better belt and braces it, ditto the stone catchers and the pretty well fabricated slimline underbody protection
If your engine has a good standard seal fitted and the pulley is plain and not scored then just go with the 2wd one and change it every few years; if pulley is scored the syncro seal set effectively repairs it

[silverbullet]

Alles klar! It's a combined labyrinth/lip seal/mudslinger then. Not cheap to make and VW are doing the stockholding for what is really a very limited demand...
I'll be grateful and see if there's any spare £ before the motor goes back in.
Thankyou chaps
I'll try not to get carried away with any wading on offer

So do the diesel syncros - conversions included - also have a special crank nose seal? Loads of the wbx-to derv swaps must have come from everyday golf and passat engines, not exactly known for their mud-plugging potential (not counting syncro variants)

Just wondered