Upper Ball Joint Woes.... the MF is Out!

[si macc]

I'm currently half way through my second upper ball joint. The allen bolts came off relatively easily but the bottom nut was completely seized, I sprayed it with WD40 (all I had to hand!) and left it over night then heated it for quite a while and the nut wouldn't even come loose or move or anything! So I got a bit drastic and bought an angle grinder and then cut off the top of the ball joint. Now this was a MAJOR error as I realised after in that I should have cut off the bottom first and then used a ball joint separator to remove from the bracket. I then carefully took off the bottom thinking I would be able to hammer the bolt from the underside to free. So after another blasting with the blow torch I can't get the blasted thing out.

I'm really stuck now as I've got the bolt cut on the top and bottom and I can't get it out, so I'm seeking advice for a very embarrased novice Thinking my options are to get some better penetrating oil and soak, continue with the blow torching and beat the poop out of it till it comes out? Any help much appreciated!!

[lloydy]

Red Westie » 03 May 2011, 21:45

Tappered joints need loading and then shocking.
The allen key bolts that attach the ball joint to the upper wishbone usually come off pretty easily, just make sure you are using good quality allen keys and the key is 'all the way home' before trying to undo.
Then slacken the ball joint nut but still leave it on 3-4 turns to protect the thread. Load the ball joint (I'm not sure exactly how)...perhaps with a scissor jack or large pry bar, then at the same time as pushing the ball joint up, SMACK the side of the hub carrier to the side of the tapper joint (big 2-3lb hammer)
Needs a really good swing so be careful not to miss.
BANG!**! it pops up and off.

Martin

I copied this from a thread the other day, might help?

[si macc]

Thanks for the reply lloydy, that was a reply to one of my previous I was unable to do this as I could not turn the 'ball joint nut' hence the angle grinding, just angle grinded the wrong bit

[lloydy]

sorry, hope someone comes up with something

[si macc]

Was thinking if something like this would work?

http://www.lasertools.co.uk/item.aspx?cat=492&item=536" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

With the idea of screwing the bolt into the bottom of the bracket to 'pop' out the last bit of the bolt?

[California Dreamin]

Hmmm well, if the ball joint 'taper' is that tight the splitter tool is still unlikely to 'pop' the joint BUT it will serve to load it ready for that 'whallop' I was talking about.
In all my years I've never failed to remove a ball joint taper but you need to be 'BOLD' and that whallop needs to be true and hard otherwise it aint coming off.
Martin

[Aidan]

if I were you I'd remove the upright and take it to engineers and get them to remove it so much easier on the bench

for future info rost off or similar rust removal fluid on the exposed threads below the nut for a few days preferably then keep the wheel on the ground and use an impact gun and socket to undo the nut, thus keeping the weight on the taper to stop the ball joint spinning, be prepared to go down and back up and down and back up the threads a few times washing with rost off before the nut will fully come off, and then the shock, if it's for scrap then you can always put the nut back on and hit the stem upwards but access poor and swinging hammer in face not good

[Allanw]

Ah yes... ROST OFF - Good Wurth products - definitly Worth it

I used to be a rep for them, it is GREAT STUFF! (The brake cleaner is a great fabric cleaner too!)

anyway - If you can get your hands on a two arm puller, you should be able to put some force onto the nut side (use a centre punch if needed, and sit a ball bearing on the cut part if the "point" of the puller is too larger diameter) load it up as much as you can, them smack the spindle part at right angle to the "bolt" with a Big F... Off Hammer - one good whack - the better the spindle is held, theeasier it is - the top part of the arm trapped tightly in a bench vise is best

From my experience, if the big hammer doesn't work there are 3 possiblities: You didn't hit it hard enough, your hammer isn't big enough. The thing is so rooted, it's probably not worth re-using

Good luck!

[horizontal kipper]

Ive got the same problem allen head bolts came out no problem, ball joint nut off no problem got my scissor splitter out ( jaw to small) so got the good old wide jaw smack it with a hammer splitter on it, normal hammer didnt shift it in the end i got a full size sledge hammer and whacked it nearly knocked the van off its axle stands splitter flew across the garden and the bleeding thing still hasnt moved

[futbus]

Dont just hit it with one hammer, use a pair of hammers in opposite sides at the same time. If you can put a little load onto the top joint, normally a piece of wood between the sping coils above the top wishbone, so that when you jack the van up from the hub the piece of wood jams against the top wishbone. then hit either side of the top ball joint once the 24mm nut is undone. you dont need to remove the 2 8mm allenkey M10 at this stage they can be taken out later. You can also load up the top joint if it is spinning to take the 24mm nut off.

Please be very careful and dont lift the van off the axle stands.

[si macc]

So after another evening of trying I'm getting nowhere fast. I've tried almost everything.

So this evening I used my new scissor type ball joint removers to put some load onto the bolt and this firstly didn't work. I gave the sides of the arm some smacks but still nothing. I then tried to get the ball joint removers into a position where I could bash it to hopefully free it, but no it wasn't moving. It's pretty hard to get the removers into a position where I can swing the FBH with full force. Next I tried to use a smaller hammer resting on the removers to give myself more space to swing and a greater surface area to hit, this didn't work either. See photo.



I then tried to bash both sides with a hammer with more swing with the FBH with the removers as tight as possible but out of the way so I didn't hit them with a hammer. Not even a glimmer of hope.

Guessing my next options are to take off the whole lot and then try to get it out in a vice? Or maybe get a better puller? I'm not sure I want to remove the whole lot as I can sense that it is going to be as difficult as the current problem and time is not on my side....

[Aidan]

From my experience, if the big hammer doesn't work ....... your hammer isn't big enough

Good luck!

[si macc]

So set to work this evening with 2 club hammers and a loaded scissor ball joint remover. Was smacking it all over, reloading the remover when it slipped. After about an hour I noticed it had moved a tiny amount which gave me the encouragement I needed to keep on bashing the F out of it! It moved a bit more so I gave it another load up on the remover and took another swing at it then 'pop' it few out and there's a nice mark on the underside of the wheel arch where it bounced off!

I just have to say a BIG BIG thanks to all of you who helped with advice and encouragement to keep on bashing. Got the new one on now so hoping it will sail through the retest.

Thanks again!!!

[California Dreamin]

Brilliant news mate...I bet you are one happy man after all this hassel.

Martin

[si macc]

Indeed I am, now I know what its like for a constipation sufferer to 'clear the path'