Starter problem

Post by **ajp** » 11 Apr 2010, 15:18

Vans always been a bit slowwww turning over but always fired so I just put it down to being 25 years young! Noticed today that the problem got much worse on a warm engine and then earlier she wasn't having any of it. Turned the key nothing... Checked the live to the starter solinoid (that was the problem last time) That was fine. Gave the the starter and the solinoid a couple of 'taps' with the handle of the socket and she started no problem, so my question is... Is it the starter or the solinoid and is it a repair or replace?? When the key was turned there was lights on dash but nothing at all (no click, nothing) from the back which makes me think its ths solinoid am I right? I did try searching the forum but if you put 'starter' into the search engine and list is endless!
Any ideas/opinions grately recieved.

1.9 wbx DG

Post by **Doctor Foster** » 11 Apr 2010, 15:28

ajp wrote:Vans always been a bit slowwww turning over but always fired so I just put it down to being 25 years young! Noticed today that the problem got much worse on a warm engine and then earlier she wasn't having any of it. Turned the key nothing... Checked the live to the starter solinoid (that was the problem last time) That was fine. Gave the the starter and the solinoid a couple of 'taps' with the handle of the socket and she started no problem, so my question is... Is it the starter or the solinoid and is it a repair or replace?? When the key was turned there was lights on dash but nothing at all (no click, nothing) from the back which makes me think its ths solinoid am I right? I did try searching the forum but if you put 'starter' into the search engine and list is endless!
Any ideas/opinions grately recieved.

1.9 wbx DG

Does sound like a packed up solenoid If no clicking when key turned but the old hammer trick is getting it to work.

Have a looksy at this https://club8090.co.uk/wiki/Al ... t_starting" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Post by **ajp** » 11 Apr 2010, 15:34

Cheers, I did look on Wiki but I didn't find that page!

Post by **Red Westie** » 11 Apr 2010, 17:20

I'll give you a list in priority...most likely first:

1) Sticking solenoid
2) Ingition switch fault (pretty common) under a tenner from GSF
3) Solenoid switch wire connection fault (spade connection needs to be 100% sound, not corroded, loose)
4) Bad earth and positive lead connections
Less likely and with different symtoms:
5) With sunsupported armetures...the phoshur bronze support bush has collapsed or worn oval.
6) Starter brushes worn out.
7) Battery low capacity, nearing the end of it's life, low electrolyte level, dead cell.

Martin

Post by **ajp** » 11 Apr 2010, 17:51

Thanks Martin thats just what the docter ordered! I'm pretty sure now its the solinoid. I started her up again after letting her cool for an hour... first time sweet as a nut. So I'm thinking sticky solinoid which is suffering from extra expansion when hot. Having read Wiki I'm going to have a look to see if I can take the solinoid apart a clean it up. I'll do the starter bush at the same time and see what that does.

So as to the list...
1) Should be covered by the above, if not can a new solinoid be bought seperate from the starter or is it an all or nothing afair?
2) Don't think its this as this (even if it was an intermitant fault) shouldn't be affected by the tempreture (?).
3) Checked, not this.
4) Again checked, pretty certain not this.
5) Sorted in my plan (hopefully)!
6) If I'm honest this is beyond my limited knowledge!!!
7) Checked, not this.

I wonder what my plans are for next weekend

Post by **Red Westie** » 11 Apr 2010, 19:24

Don't be so quick to write off the possibility of a faulty ignition switch.....they can give these exact symptoms.....
Martin

Post by **ajp** » 11 Apr 2010, 19:53

At the risk of looking very stupid ... Where is the ignition switch? I know what it looks like but I know not its location...

E D I T: just been looking on the JK site and saw the hotstart relay, might this help?

Post by **ermie571** » 11 Apr 2010, 20:18

hi ajp,

no idea about the hot start relay....but have done the ignition switch....there are some good instructions on a thread somewhere.

found it - our friend red westie (wonder what colour and model he drives!)

https://club8090.co.uk/forum/viewtopic.p ... h#p7462404" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Post by **Doctor Foster** » 11 Apr 2010, 20:30

you could run a wire from the battery positive terminal to the solenoid connection and apply 12v directly to it just to confirm wether its turning or not. That could tell you if the igntion switch has a fault

Just a thought.

Post by **ajp** » 11 Apr 2010, 21:21

Right a plan has been formulated for next weekend. After a hours worth of Wiki and Haynes. New starter switch (daft not too at the price), Going to try the hot start relay from JK as well (again not expensive so why not)and starter motor off, new bush and strip and clean the solinoid.

I know I could try one at a time to locate the exact problem but time is a factor so I might as well jump headfirst!

I'll let you know how it goes...

Post by **Doctor Foster** » 11 Apr 2010, 21:27

ajp wrote:Right a plan has been formulated for next weekend. After a hours worth of Wiki and Haynes. New starter switch (daft not too at the price), Going to try the hot start relay from JK as well (again not expensive so why not)and starter motor off, new bush and strip and clean the solinoid.

I know I could try one at a time to locate the exact problem but time is a factor so I might as well jump headfirst!

I'll let you know how it goes...

Interesting about the hot start relay. Have heard about it fitted to the old type 2 vw's.

Post by **Red Westie** » 11 Apr 2010, 21:28

Just prepare yourself for some heavy duty soldering....the brushes and copper braided leads are heavy duty (because of the amount of amps involved) and will take a hefty soldering iron to de-solder/re-solder (the braided ends are criped and soldered)
Not a bad job if you have the right equipment.
Martin

Post by **ajp** » 11 Apr 2010, 21:38

Red Westie wrote:Just prepare yourself for some heavy duty soldering....the brushes and copper braided leads are heavy duty (because of the amount of amps involved) and will take a hefty soldering iron to de-solder/re-solder (the braided ends are criped and soldered)
Not a bad job if you have the right equipment.
Martin

After reading up on what was involved with this I've opted to avoid this pleasure and just change the bush. The brushes are above my technical grade!

Thankyou everyone for your time, much appreciated.

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