grinding sound from gearbox most prominent in 4th/5th

[Epiphone]

My 1989 2.1l Engine(SS) bus makes a grinding sound when only in 4th and 5th, and only when accelerating.

The sound comes from directly under the gear leaver, it seems the sound is conducting up the gear stick.

Its done over 200,000 miles. Could this be the clutch or gearbox, or something at the front of the van with the gear leaver?

[Fritz]

Epi,,,,,,,Not a good 1st post on our forum I think......

If you can play a tune with this noise during acceleration, ie noise apparent during up shift/acceleration

and nothing on the over run may be due to a failing inputshaft bearing on the gear box .........


Regards


Fritz,,,,,,,,,,

[Aidan]

at an eductaed guess either a selector rod bearing on 4/5 selector rod has failed and fork is not supported and transmitting to selector rod or the mainshaft is moving about in the case, possible cause mainshaft bearing failure or more likely input bearing failure, the mainshaft/back of 4th gear are then rubbing against the selectror shaft and transmitting down the selector rods. Oil drop will show the state of the drain plug magnet and thus the state of the internals and any broken bits will likely show up.
Input bearing failure will also show as leaking input seal damp oil leak bellhousing

[Epiphone]

ok thanks all and sorry Fritz, yes I read some other posts regarding grinding in the gearbox. But were not exactly like my symptoms. Just wanted to put the question out there.

Its in the garage now, getting a service at least, and then will have to take on bigger jobs like gearbox after xmas

[Mr Bean]

My five speed box failed twice, once at (if speedo is to be believed) 110,000 miles and again shortly afterwards under warrenty. The first failure was due to poor design/hardening process when the rediculously sharp corners in the selector actuating blanking initiated a crack which dropped one of the arms and lost me fourth and fifth gears. The second was the 4/5 gear synchro hub disintegrating (a known weakness) and causing the ridiculously fragile tin ball slide cage to part such that ther balls escaped and the actuator gouged its way down through the centre casting. I wasn't aware of Aiden at the time and had to source the ball cages and hub from Bear Transmissions for my rebuinder and turn up a steel insert which I locked into a purpose machined aperture in the damaged centre section. (I have a lathe and mill) In my opinion/experience the five speed box is a bit fragile in the selector area and can fail catastrophically if left to fester. Nuff said!
Cheers
Wolfie

[Epiphone]

got some gearbox oil today. Just wanna check its the right stuff as there are of course many variations

LiquiMoly - GL 4 - SAE 85 W - 90 - Specifications API GL 4 - Mineral Based Gear oil for normal to high loads

there was also available synthetic oils 75W-90 grade GL5 or 75W-90 grade GL4+, but on some other threads what Ive bought looks recommended.

[Aidan]

that's the correct oil

[Epiphone]

good lad Aidan,u really are dependable

so ive got 3 litres of the stuff, is that enough?

also got the oil tray/canister thing

so hopefully, in the next couple of weeks, gonna try dropping the oil and see the results

[Aidan]

i'd put 4 in, but you won't get all that's in out so 3 may be enough, I know vw say 3 1/2 litres petrol 4 litres diesel, i'd go 4 litres for both

[Epiphone]

So in my quest to find a garage in south Germany, I got a specialist to have a drive round the block in my bus.

Apart from the gear selection being totally messed up, but unrelated to the gearbox itself. The guy said that he's heard worse and it would be OK for this year/summer, but to get it look at in Autumn for example. So I will probably aim for that as Im getting a shed load of welding done in the next month.

If I get the box renovated then I will of course get these South Afican plastic plates fitted, which help the oil flow and oil temperature. Ive seen some on German ebay, what is a normal price for these things? (EUR/POUNDS)

SA_oil_plates.jpg

[Aidan]

a set cost about 50 and depends on who how where with fitting costs, my machine shop charges x and my time/vehicle running costs taking them and collecting them plus my time fitting them and supplying correct fittings and sundries works out £100 supplied and fitted from me
syncro-services seem to be best supplier

[Epiphone]

So as I promised (to myself), basically the end of the summer now and had 2 successfull trips to Nice, France and Lake Garda, Italy behind us. Body work is now up to scratch, even had the spray can out last weekend for a nice coat of Titian Red over the undercoat.

So gonna get some quotes for gearbox renewal and also engine waterjacket seals. So as this is 2 major jobs and expensive too. Im therefore considering getting everything done in 1 fowl swoop. So here are a few questions for the resident experts:

1: To open the gear box up/get replaced etc, does this require to remove the engine and gearbox together? So to save on labour costs, I can get this done together.
2: If you guys were facing a gearbox and engine job like this, would you not bother and trade in gearbox and engine for a new VW gearbox and WBX engine?
3: Or would you even forget VW Waterboxes and look for e.g. an Audi gearbox/engine etc

[Aidan]

you can drop them both together on the floor and seperate
chances of finding a good wbx and a good gearbox are slim, especially a five speed
don't even think about it they won't fit and they give you 5 reverse gears and one very slow forward one
all imho of course

[Epiphone]

just got a healthy tax rebate and its burning a hole in my pocket as we speak

whos got some ideas for me?

[Aidan]

www.vw-classicparts.de
get yourself a new box