How long is a piece of string question....engine life.

[mikey9]

When buying a van - a question I wondered was - is it better to buy a relatively low mileage (60-80k) van with orig engine - or look at those with recent recons.....?

I decided 75k on an original engine - no obvious rebuild - but made the wrong decision (water jackets split - coolant etc...)

Obviously soooo much depends upon whether reg oil AND coolant changes (with phosphate free) have been carred out over 17 years - it is very much specific to any engine however.....in an attempt to understand what kind of mileage can be expected from an (at least) 17 year old engine.

In a (psuedo) scientific attempt to gather info.....

How many miles have you done on your original VW engine (or suspected to be original - check your V5 against the engine number - make sure it hasn't got a * at the end etc.).
-----------------------------------------------------
Engine Type: (e.g. DG, DJ, MV etc)


Year:


Mileage done: (ks)


Oil and Coolant Servicing if known: (e.g. FULL VW SH, Own changes for last 50k miles etc.)



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I will start
Engine Type: (e.g. DG, DJ, MV etc)
DG

Year:
1990

Mileage done: (ks)
86000 (then poooof!)

Oil and Coolant Servicing if known: (e.g. FULL VW SH, Own changes for last 50k miles etc.)
Unknown to 75k - then Oil/Filter ev 4k

[Red Westie]

Low mileage is always good because of everything else that wears (gearbox, differential, wheel bearings, driveshafts, CV joints, steering rack etc etc) But the reality is unfortunately, it is very rare to be able to gaurantee the provenance of the vehicles we buy and to have an owner who was that maticulous that he saved every last reciept and recorded all repairs.....IF ONLY......
The truth is....given the 17-28 year age of these bus types it very often 'GOES ON CONDITION' alone.
Of course low mileage vehicles, recent engine swap outs, major overhauls etc are going to be more attractive but I still maintain that it is the overall condition and how 'GENUINE' the vehicle appears (there hasn't been work carried out that hides faults) that is most important.
If you are the lucky sod that goes to look at a van that is owned by an 80 year old from new, who has had it dealer seviced every year, stored under blankets in a warm garage, professionally valetted after each yearly trip to Skegness and had it wax oiled from new with full documented history....well then you lucky bugger. For the rest looking.....yes take unto account reciepts and history but make you decision based on overall condition not just on non verified mileage.

1989 2.1 MV California
164,000KM (now 102,000 miles on second hand speedo)
Loads of reciepts and money spent but I can't make head nor tails of it cus it's in German.
Very well maintained sinced I've owned it (Ex VW mechanic)

Martin

[Titus A Duxass]

Low mileage is always good

- Not true, an engine that has a good number of motorway miles is more likely to be better than one that has low milage and hs only been run around town.

It will have less wear and tear on the drive train, it will have been running at the correct temperature for longer periods of time.

My had 250,000ks on the clock when I blew it up down to a broken water pipe. Up to that point it ran like a dream giving me mid-30s in return.

[mikey9]

Red Westie - all good points (I want that 80 year old's van - give us a clue where the barn is.....)

Judging by the posts on here (Including mine!) - there are many people who buy without the knowledge/ability to actually do that assessment using their eyes/ears alone.

The amount I have learned over the last year of ownership has been amazing (mainly due to this site and others (GOwesty, Thesamba brickyard, benplace and many others))

I just thought it might be useful/interesting to get a gauge of engine life expectancy - for the novice (you really don't hear of many 100 - 150k wasserboxers on here....?)

[mikey9]

Sorry Titus - I was typing as you replied - there is one 150k mile wasserboxer.....! well - not any more.....

[Mocki]

mines done 124k so far, 1989 dj, original engine, going to need original zorst replacing very soon......

being stood does the most damage to the water system (and the body), driving it is good for it.

[Willoughby]

- but made the wrong decision (water jackets split - coolant etc...)

U don't say Aircooled is where it's at.
-----------------------------------------------------
Engine Type: CU


Year: 81
Mileage done: 67K
Oil and Coolant Servicing if known: (e.g. FULL VW SH, Own changes for last 50k miles etc.)

FSH

K

[mikey9]

Willoughby,
I wonder if the Full VW Sh gives a clue to longevity - at the least this means someone was actually having the work done - on a schedule.

Given the same on a wasserboxer - to the book servicing with the correct fluids - continuous use - long runs - I wonder if the engine (or more correctly - seals/gaskets) life could be 150k miles.....some evidence here already to suggest yes!

I suppose I wanted to keep away from Aircooled for a couple of reasons -

• Memories of wooly hat and gloves plus ice on the inside of my Bay and my wife likes to be warm.
  The fear of an extra 10 years on the body (although there are better original bodied a/c vehicles than my 1991!)

[Titus A Duxass]

I wonder if the Full VW Sh gives a clue to longevity

- most definately, mine has FSH (VW) upto 200,000ks.
Another thing is the number of owners, mine has only one previous owner (he must have like the bus).

[davidm]

Mine has done about 125000, on original engine. i say about, cos speedo cable broke late last year and i haven't repaired it yet. Its a 1985 1.9 dg. I have service book, but not much in it. farmer i bought it off said he had changed oil regularly, but it didnt have correct coolant. has now, but god knows what the head bolts are like. he was 2nd owner, his father the 1st. I have had it 3 years. Engine seems o.k. had compression test recently, in trying to diagnose running problems. mechanic said that was what he would do 1st anyway, and didnt report any problems there. I've often wondered how much longer engine might last.

[Willoughby]

Think u hit the nail on the head. My history is not VW but loads of it.

Not to sure how many non VW garages know what is the correct fluid or even care.

Heating is an issue, not a great job but well worth doing. I had to removed the whole system and make sure every bit was gas tight. Took two of us a whole day and some but now works a dream.

Was up ur neck of the woods last thu lovely part of the world, Misses loves dolphins so may need to get u to PM me when they are a jumpin'


K

[toomanytoys]

Need to diferenciate between wbx and D/TD..

WBX will do a lot of miles but its mainly due to age that the problems come.. most wont have had a coolant change every 3 years.. and this is the biggest factor to engine life... (VW said "for life") I have taken quite a few apart and it is apparent which engines have been "looked after"... no/poor coolant is the worst you can do.. nasty nasty nasty..

My Syncro DG doka has 187k km on it and the coolant is a nice fresh green colour.. I hope it has been changed regular, but no garantee.. it is only 16 years old too.. but any engine that is that age will be due something.. I have seen 60k mile engines that have gone, through lack of/low use and improper coolant... in my experience 100-150k miles is about the norm for them to last, and usually its a head stud that gives.. or the jacket leaks... Many USA vehicles see a lot more.. a couple I know of have done 250k...

D/TD.. seems coz they are laid over on the side and worked very hard.. 100k is about it... maybe if it was cosseted.. more...

[jaylo264]

toomanytoys , my vw dealer told me categorric that my green coolant was WRONG , sold me many litres of PINK ( ? G12 ? ) concentrate .

Mikey , there really is only one rule , since you can never truly know the history , the engine has to come second to the body / chassis tinstuff , and ( there are only two rules ) never buy anything used above the latitude of watford and ( there are only 3 ) disbelieve EVERYTHING the vendor sez ........
jaylo

[syncrosimon]

The best way is to buy one where you factor in the cost of engine rebuild into the equation.

If your camper is running well, why would you sell it, so many barstewards realise that something nasty and expensive is gonna happen, so sell it on to someone who is new to the game.

Check the owner out as much as the van, has he or she had the resources to mend things as they go wrong. A good sign would be a bunch of receipts for little things, that only an owner would know would need replacing. What other cars has the seller got, and what condition are they in.

That said, there are decent vans out there, just go and look at a bunch, and you will soon find a decent one. A club 80-90 member is a good place to start.

My own experience of flat 4's is very good. My dad had a business in the 80's where he had 5 or 6 caravelles (one after the other) when they were a current model, he ran them till 130.000 miles, then traded at VW(still running fine), only 1 broke down, and that was a plastic part snapping, loosing the coolant, no mechanical failures over 700,000 miles in 5 or 6 vehicles, all VW serviced. Me and my brother learnt to drive in them, and they were thrashed, flat out, like you do. So they do last, if you find a good-un.

[mikey9]

Absolutely as toomanytoys says - we need to differentiate between wassers and D/TDs. Interesting that average engine life may end up around the same 100-125k miles.....

Also intrigued to know why anyone thinks US engines may be good for a fair few more (with 250k miles quoted - also by Lucas at Gowesty!). Maybe it is the distilled water thing.......

Willoughby - Pm'd you bout dolphins as I don't think it should be in Tech Q&A's

Jaylo - I reckon you and me are keeping Hawco going on sales of G12 alone - I reckon I should (I think I now have....) have an account there. Rule four is never buy from a country where they use salt on the roads.......hope no-one reads this if we come to sell.....

Interesting stuff tho - keep it coming - maybe worth a summary for the wiki?