1.6/1.9 diesel. Which is best?

Post by **Ian Hulley** » 09 Jul 2007, 13:13

ringo wrote:I don't want to go fast up hills.

Ringo

Owt weighing 2 tonnes with only 1915cc isn't likely to fly up hills mate

Let alone one with a rowing boat glued on the roof

Ian.

Post by **HOT 1200** » 23 Jul 2007, 10:47

I dont really think there is such a thing as a 'fast' T25....?
Fast compared to what??, when you think about the weight, gearing and aerodynamics, it all points towards 'these vans were never meant to go fast', you need massive amounts of BHP to push a T25 at ' average family car' speeds...i.e able to cruise at anything upto 100mph!!! and keep it there, even on the hills...
T25's simply didnt leave the drawing board with this concept in mind...
Bit like trying to get a boat to fly.......it can be done, but by the time you have achieved it, your left with a poor mans plane that wont float if you know what I mean

YOU have to work out what you want........
Lets face it, unless you only drive a few hundred miles a year, EVERBODY wants reliability...so this has to be on the 'engine wish list'. If you're going camping or even a daily driver, nobody wants Breakdowns and weak points in the van....
I think the Diesels are great, the 1.6na & 1.7 na are now getting old and starting to fail but most have gone twice around the clock and are 20+ years old....
The 1.6TD is a great little engine, enough power for most but can be fragile when hauling the heavy T25 around, abuse it and you can expect problems...
The 1.9 waterboxer engine, perhaps the most 'lost' engine out there, It does not offer diesel eco yet is does not offer the raw output of the 112bhp 2.1....in short, its a compromise engine, a good all rounder.
With todays fuel prices, the 112bhp motor is still ok for occasional use campers, but really this engine lends its self well to LPG conversions. There is of course the whole 'wet liner' debate on both the 1.9 & 2.1 engines, its a weakness in the engine that can be 'nursed' by using the correct coolent and avoidance of sudden temp changes.
There is of course the 'alternative engine' route.....1.9 TD & TDI vw engines will fit with some messing around, (I have done this with good results), there are other diesel types that will also fit via a conversion kit, my advice, keep it simple, use as many VW parts as possible, that way if you do break down (perhaps abroad), you stand a chance of finding the part you need and the non english speaking garage may just be able to fix it......!!!
All said and done, engine choice is YOUR CHOISE. Do not be put off by others, yes listen to them and consider advice, I must of been told a dozen times my diesel conversion would not work and if it did, it would not last........I worked with factual information rather than 3rd party hear say....and got the job done......after clocking up more than 10,000 miles, I can say it does work and still works...!!
Yet guess what, even with more power, its still like driving a T25, it slows down on hills, breaks all the speed limits going down hills and would still rather cruise at 60-65, even with the taller gearged petrol box even though 80-85mph is possible....GaV

Post by **DJZ** » 23 Jul 2007, 18:09

My 16D is well past it's sell by date, it doesn't go over 50 mph without blowing oil seals but I've forgotten what a petrol station looks like. I've been told to upgrade to this and that but I am going to get this one rebuild and keep chugging along in the inside lane stress free and saving money on fuel costs.

Post by **OXI** » 24 Jul 2007, 21:05

I've owned both the 1.6D and the 1.7D.

You can actually notice the difference slightly.

I found it easier to live with the 1.7D obviously. It's very slow but economical. 40+mpg and 55mph cruising is the norm.

Frank

Post by **bulldog** » 31 Jul 2007, 19:28

All I can say if I'm being a good boy and cruising about 60/70 I get 45 to the gallon if I'm naughty as I was coming back from a very rainy Cornwall recently I got 35 to the gallon a lot of difference 60 to down hill strong wind be hind me 80. I run a 19 non turbo.

Post by **windysurfer** » 01 Aug 2007, 18:12

whats the engine out off bulldog?
Also what gearbox are you using with it?

cheers

Post by **bulldog** » 01 Aug 2007, 18:46

Hi windysurferuk

It's a 1Y engine code, got an Audi stamp on it but it's used in a lot of VW and Audi's vehicles. The answer is I don't know?
The other question, I got the answer to that it's the original gear box but I am looking out for a five speed gear box but will need to do some research to see what will go in and match the engine.

Post by **windysurfer** » 01 Aug 2007, 19:26

I've got an AEF fitted to mine 1.9 none turbo out of a polo i think.

I'm just about to change the gearbox from the original 5 speed 1.6d box to a 4 speed petrol box as it reving its nut of at the minute.

Is your original box a petrol?
Must have quite a low final drive to get to 80?

cheers

Post by **bulldog** » 01 Aug 2007, 20:49

When I got me van it was a 16D BUT the engine was knackered so I put the 19D lump in it, never changed the box's.

Post by **SplendiferousII** » 02 Aug 2007, 13:11

windysurferuk wrote:
Is your original box a petrol?
Must have quite a low final drive to get to 80?

cheers

My 83 1.6d van has only done 44k so I guess its still runing its original 4 speed box.

Mine does 80 at least down hill with the wind behind it. I get scared above 80 but i think it would pull 90 if I had the nerve.

I get 56 out of mine before I grab 4th gear.

Speeds taken from van speedo - so allow for 10% error.

Post by **windysurfer** » 02 Aug 2007, 19:51

i think the difference is mine is a 5 speed box
gearbox code is ABP and has a 5th ratio of .816 and a final drive of 5.5

I'm swapping it for a 4 speed code abd with a 4th ratio of .85 and final drive of 4.83.

I'd be intrested as to which gearbox code you currently have fitted.

There is a list of code on the Brickyard forum and a speed/rpm calc here

http://www.partsemporium.co.uk/rpm%20&% ... ulator.htm

It's interesting how much diffrence just changing your tyre size has on your vans gearing

Post by **thewibbit** » 03 Aug 2007, 19:15

Lets face it boys and girls... the ONLY engine that should be in these vans is the Aircooled petrol (with gas if you like). I'll never know what posessed VW to go with the 'other' engines... they sound all wrong for a start and there's potentially tons more stuff to go wrong (ie a complete water cooling system) and those exhausts... the mind boggles!
Our Aircooled 2l has never failed in the 23 years it's been in our family and it's done some serious trips!! Oh and they didn't have to cut a big hole in the front of it!
Bring it on!!

[/u]

Post by **lloyd** » 05 Aug 2007, 16:23

thewibbit wrote:Lets face it boys and girls... the ONLY engine that should be in these vans is the Aircooled petrol (with gas if you like). I'll never know what posessed VW to go with the 'other' engines... they sound all wrong for a start and there's potentially tons more stuff to go wrong (ie a complete water cooling system) and those exhausts... the mind boggles!
Our Aircooled 2l has never failed in the 23 years it's been in our family and it's done some serious trips!! Oh and they didn't have to cut a big hole in the front of it!
Bring it on!! [/u]

Last good van was 1971. type 1/2 engine, small bolt pattern wheels, disc front brakes..

Or was last good van the 67 model year?

I started with a 66, then 68, 69, 61 and 71 hi-top ... still have 61.. it's had engines from stock to 6cylinder Corvair turbo spider engine in it and back to 1.6 near stock. 71 was bored & stroked to 2.0, dual carbs, etc. and a 4.56 ring & onion... it was great!

Now have our 1.9 and find it much nicer handling, more room and enough power for now.

end of rant

Lloyd

Personally, I would steer clear of the 1.6d & 1.7d, the 1.6td is good.. 1.9 petrol is little stronger then 1.6td.. 1.9td aaz is good, but better with taller gearbox, 1.9tdi is super if you spend a fortune regearing to get engine rpm down. I would like a 86+ 1.6td base van with a 1.9aaz or tdi and re-geared gearbox, intercooler, oil cooler, etc. Biggest reason for engine failures is drivers push engine too hard and toast them. All td's should have exhaust gas temp guage!! All engines should have oil pressure guage!! You would be amazed how hot they get.. and anything above about 840c pre-turbo or 750 after turbo is asking for trouble!! With exhaust temp kept in safe range, engines will last.. if not kept in safe range, you warp and crack the head.. These 1.6td, 1.9aaz and tdi engines were designed for cars, not big boxes.. The added weight / wind resistance works them many times harder then in a car. If you drive engine at half throttle instead of on the floor, engine will last a long time. Engines in ars go 200k, in van goes 100k. And the only rule is there are exeptions to every rule.