Offside sill

[AngeloEvs]

Never been happy with my butt welding ability on thin sheet! Without a joggler I would cut across the body panel as straight as possible. Tack a 30mm (or wider) strip of mild steel to the rear of the upper body panel so that at least 15mm is available below the panel, easy to do as there is no lower body panel to stop you clamping it. Tack the new panel onto that so that the lwer section meets the upper panel on the same plane. Leave a gap of a few mm between the panels and tap the welded section back a tad so that you can apply a skim of filler after grinding it all back.

[CovKid]

Now thats clever. Gives you a firm slot to push to. Ta.

[AngeloEvs]

forgot to mentiom, I would drill 5mm holes on the strip every inch or so, clamp it on to the rear of the upper body panel and from inside the van puddle weld the holes, bit like spot welding.......then from the outside tack the edges to to the strip and then fit the new panel.

[CovKid]

Glad you mentioned that. Was just figuring how best to do that and came up with similar plan. I reckon I'll need all of tomorrow to cut an prep so everything is spot on then Sunday on the Sip Super welder.

[weldore]

hmmmm....are you not going to join the floor to the sill then ralph?

ooops sorry i mist one of your posts...carry on

its interesting chaps

[CovKid]

Yep, will be 'gluing' it as suggested. Also means that before thats all in, I can get in there with rust prevention stuff to halt a repeat. The great thing about all this is that because I've 'rollered' mine, patch repairs are a breeze. Hopefully the description and associated pics in this thread will give all of us some idea of the construction of this sill and how it can be repaired. Not suitable as a definitive WIKI article possibly because of the different ways of attacking the problem but it should give a good oversight and whether an owner feels confident enough to tackle it.

As I say I'm NOT a welder, but I have used MIG and I do understand how crucial preparation is. More pics tomorrow!

[weldore]

yeah i rollered mine too..excellent work there ,i would have never thought of it to be so easy and great results too

i might weld for a living but im not a panel man so i try to take in as much as i can when the welding topics come up

[CovKid]

Snap. But I'll give it a go. I like the idea of tacking in a backing piece to butt two panels together though.

[weldore]

a section that size would be a nightmare to keep straight with but jointing,,,me thinks .i think your on the right track.the other thing i was thinking was..for the floor section..maybe if you offered the new panel up and marked on the inside where the floor would meet and used a length of 6mm rod on the back of the sill..weld that on so it gives you a nice thick ledge to weld the floor to ..but your not going that route so ill shut up

[CovKid]

Taking me a lot longer to prepare everything prior to welding but heres a couple of thoughts that have occured to me on the butt weld. I'll use a backing strip as suggested to reduce the chance of blow throughs but clamping it all together won't be simple. I figure that maybe I can use a row of small nuts, bolts and washers to hold the three pieces together, tack every 20mm then fill any remaining holes with weld afterwards. Sound feasible?

[weldore]

you can do a lap joint on it instead and weld through the new panel onto the old...bit of linishing and a bit of filler after..the paint should come off on the old panel to leave it lower than the paint level

[AngeloEvs]

You could clamp the strip to the upper body panel first and have it in place. Offer up the new repair panel and use self tappers but leave the bottom sill flange till last as it is easy to clamp and get pressure (i.e. mole grips), its jobs like this that really benefit from using an auto darkening helmet as you have one hand free to push the panel with a a socket bar or a chisel and tack as you go along.

[CovKid]

Not a lot happening today as need to get the 15mm angle on Monday but heres latest for anyone who likes following projects with pics:

These are taken looking towards rear of vehicle. As you can imagine, the sill and side panel have flanges that go inwards at right angles to enable side panels to fasten to upright posts. These were then spot-welded from the inside at the factory by robots. I've now ground (carefully) the remanants of these off the pillars (this is where you normally see that vertical seam join) as well as internal sill edge and slapped a load of hammerite inside internal sills and areas that may rust in time. Inner sills are made from metal at least twice the thickness of panels, for side impact strength.




From what I can see, and I think Angeloevs will back me up on this, any leaks from side windows make their way down inside of panel and puddle on the floor in there, eventually rotting the floor out. Fridges also contribute, as do major spillages. Almost every T25 out there seems to suffer this (try removing internal trim to see what I mean). On that basis, once panel is in (and I'll cover that with photos) i'll pay attention to side window seals, drain holes, and make sure everything has a good coat of paint in there.

The first sign of trouble seems to be MAJOR rust along sill/body seam, giving you a clue that the floor (which is level with that seam, is rotting away. Unfortunately, and particularly if you have cupboards that have been there for years, you're unlikely to discover the damage until it works its way to outside of van. My tip therefore would be to investigate if the rust along sill seam line is giving you trouble as you may be able to save that side (as I'm doing) before it spreads to supporting pillars, jacking points and so forth. Cheaper to do at this stage than trying to rebuild the whole side.

Incidentally, heres the range of panels available through Hardrians. They do front chrome bumpers though why not rear is a mystery as its the rears that nearly always get damaged! :

91-13-002
SIDE SILL R/H
91-13-003
SIDE SILL L/H
91-13-101
FRONT BUMPER CHROME
91-13-112
FR/RR CORNER BUMPER BLACK
91-13-112
FR/RR CORNER BUMPER BLACK
91-13-113
FR/RR CORNER BUMPER BLACK
91-13-113
FR/RR CORNER BUMPER BLACK
91-13-140
REAR CENTRE BUMPER BLACK
91-13-264
FRONT WING REAR PART R/H
91-13-265
FRONT WING REAR PART L/H
91-13-380
PETROL CARB/DSL TANK 68MM HOLE >84
91-13-380
PETROL CARB/DSL TANK 68MM HOLE >84
91-13-381
PETROL CARB/DSL TANK 48MM HOLE 85>
91-13-381
PETROL CARB/DSL TANK 48MM HOLE 85>
91-13-382
PETROL TANK INJECTION 48MM HOLE
91-13-412
LOWER FRONT DOOR SKIN R/H
91-13-413
LOWER FRONT DOOR SKIN L/H
91-13-414
LOWER SIDE DOOR SKIN
91-13-500
LOWER REAR WING R/H
91-13-501
LOWER REAR WING L/H
91-13-506
REAR WHEEL ARCH R/H
91-13-507
REAR WHEEL ARCH L/H

[AngeloEvs]

The prep is the time cosuming part and you seem to be well into it Covkid. A lot of satisfaction to be had from doing these jobs. I was suprised at how much water leaked from the sliding window and even more so when I found it wasn't the seal but the design of the frame. Like you say, its not just the fridge or the vents that do the long term damage and that area does need a lot of added protection once the repairs are done..........keep the pics coming in, like you say may help others, especially since you are doing this with the most basic of kit.

[CovKid]

What I haven't showed you is how far up this panel comes. I've just put it against the side to give you an idea. It actually sits right on the lower lip of the crease above the sill line. From here, could cut the new panel down and fix a backing plate behind it OR (and Chickenkoop seems keen), cut the old panel right up to that lip, fix new one to it and then blend in afterwards. For sides, use the 15mm angle (with strategic notches to help it curve, then finally pull to lower sill edge and weld that. That doesn't seem a bad idea as it would give me a definate line to follow at the top and just needs a little weight put on it to get the tacks in.

Although surrounding areas 'look' scabby, they're actually very sound, if not rock solid. Not exactly happy doing this but better now than later. Chickenkoop will be round tomorrow to give a second eye to proceedings. If we can tackle this - anyone can. If it comes together as we hope, I'll definately WIKI this.



Again this is looking towards the rear (rear arch will be on your left)