Lifting suspension questions

[..lee..]

i`m still running the spring assisters front and rear as my springs are still the standard ones. baxters fronts allow hight to be adjusted and damping so best of both worlds. rear height comes from a spacer i cant complain about the shocks they totally transformed the van. springs, jury is still out so sticking with what i got for now. have even concidered air bags but downsides to those too.

off road i guess you need a soft ride to allow articulation but then on road the van will feel bad. for the amount of offroading i do id rather a van that handles well and blasts b roads without drama. when it comes to offroading the lack of compliance can easily be over come by airing down slightly and useing the dif locks.

[syncropaddy]

Air bags would be ideal as you can adjust height and spring rate but their Achilles heel would be if a stick or something punctured the bag

[..lee..]

my thoughts exactly,i did wonder if you could wrap them in a protective something but with a snapped spring a little improvising you would get home.

[manxman]

now i got no personal experiance on the seikel`s but i`ve heard lot of different comments and views and formed an opinion on this.

apparently seikels were designed for lightweight van and doka to do desert raceing. people seem to suggest their for heavy vehicles. " contradiction me thinks ". that initially puzzled me slightly.

i`ve also heard that although they are advertised as being a specific spring rate they are in fact progressive." this makes sense to me having a rally background " and when fitted to a heavy van the lighter coils bind and then you end up with only the heavy coils suspending which gives a hard ride.

this also puts strain on the spring that its not designed for and causes the pigtails to break." mmmmmm food for thought ".

so my opinion " which is probally worth squat is " if you have a really light van the progressive coils will soften it somewhat and then ramp up when you jump or hit a big dip as in rally which is what they`ve been designed for, medium vans dont benifit from this so suspension feels hard and is why people complain about them, heavy vans also dont get the benefit of the progressive coils but the extra weight is more suited to the heavy spring rate so feel ok.

they are also very expensive and with this doubt spinning around in my head my money is atm staying firmly in my pocket.

now this is only my opinion and i will be more than happy for someone to change it for me as i need to change my springs also..

lee.

I like the sound of Seikels if as you say they were designed for the DOKA, they are however significantly more expensive than the Trialmaster springs, also I notice Bernd Jaeger does not do longer shocks so would be worried that they might not give me the clerance for my tyres.

another question is why does no one do longer front shocks are they not needed?

I think my problem at the moment is i've very little movement in my suspension now due to using big spacers for tire clearance and so the springs are already preloaded quite a bit if that makes sense, if I sort that out no doubt I'll have to start cutting the front arches.

[..lee..]

baxter has developed longer front shocks with adjustable damping and height adjustment and rears to match. i have them on mine.

http://www.brickwerks.co.uk/shop?page=s ... ory_id=173


lee.

[manxman]

I didn't realise they were longer, I'm waiting for him to get back to me with a price for the rears, I'll send another email

[jed the spread]

I like the sound of Seikels if as you say they were designed for the DOKA,

With very very very long range fuel tanks, a far more heavier than a petrol wasser leaker engine and recovery stuff, a couple of heavier wheels etc I would take a guess at it being heavier than a 14" standard camper.

This is no light weight







I mean how much fuel alone do you reckon this thing must use on a special through sand?

jed

[axeman]

the rally doka(s) may well have had long range tanks and some recovery gear, but it would have been striped to the bones with any thing that was not needed (interia wise), even if it had an 80l aux tank allowing 20kg for the tank that would only add 100kg max, 2 spaire wheel maybe 50kg? outher weight saving things from the photos it's got the alu drop sides, no windows in the back of the cab all add up.

as for the engine, i cant imagine it would have been a diesle? i would have thought they would have been a dj, may be an audi 5 pot, unlikaly as this was S/A only and the van is 16inch german and LHD very unlikaly to be porsche, but if it were porsche it would have been air cooled so i dont realy think so. although some place i read that these engined busses were used as surport veicles for the event, brings me back to the dj as the 2 rhd 16inch vans rallied in OZ were so called "factory" vans. what outher options would there have been?

cant realy see there being that much total difference in total wet weight between one of these vans and a normal that any of us drive. what do you recon a vindic weighs got to be at least 70kg then i normaly have sally and madaline in too

[jed the spread]

very unlikaly to be porsche, but if it were porsche it would have been air cooled so i dont realy think so.

may be an audi 5 pot, unlikaly as this was S/A only and the van is 16inch german and LHD

i would have thought they would have been a dj,

Really... my money would be on the Audi with the gear box mods but I know nothing about it really...

, even if it had an 80l aux tank allowing 20kg for the tank that would only add 100kg max

Second section, Ghadames – Ghat (1095 km)
Sixth section, Agadez – Gao (1146 km)

Basic school boy maths is 1l of water weighs 1 kg



Do you think it needs more than 155l of petrol to do those miles, in a desert, in sand, going flat out, in a DJ 2.1? I cant find any information about it on the net. It would be great to know more about it.

jed

[syncropaddy]

Just a thought ...... IF ..... the Seikel springs were designed for a rally DoKa why is everyone putting them on their Syncro Campers? When VW made Syncro campers they used standard springs!

[jed the spread]

Just a thought ...... IF ..... the Seikel springs were designed for a rally DoKa why is everyone putting them on their Syncro Campers? When VW made Syncro campers they used standard springs!

Because the doka was really heavy and had to take a battering maybe? I just thought about how much the fuel must weigh and altered my previous post

jed

[Russel]

Because they work F...... well and have the best track record of any syncro spring and an unrivaled knowledge base went into their manufacture.
This discusion is just like the decoupler one it can go on for infinity. As usual you will get those with the atitude of standard parts but they will all have bigger rims fitted and engines
Russel

[syncropaddy]

As usual you will get those with the attitude of standard parts but they will all have bigger rims fitted and engines
Russel

Yes Russel you are correct ..... but we have bigger rims cuz we can't get proper tyres in 14" and we have bigger engines cuz we are fed up trying to push a garden shed around with a hair dryer ..... but then again there are people who go to the other extremes ..... aren't there?

[Russel]

Nothing wrong with going to the extremes as long as you realize the limits.Most of us are using these vehicles far beyond their design intentions. We are just lucky they were well engineered.
Another Question for the experts" not meaning this in a nasty way" how many of you have experience with all these different springs and shocks to be able to give full advice.I haven't used Simon's or the trailmaster setups but have used all the others.
I use HD 2WD springs on the front of my doka with other suspension mods,new 16 shock and for its use this works well for me. But it has other mods with these springs.
As usual it has been an experiment from the beginning but is now fine tuned and i am very happy with it.
I have used and fitted a lot of different suspension,tyre setups and give advice from personal experience and knowledge.
The Seikles dont give a lot of lift to a light vehicle ? Reason, to keep the suspension geometry within adjustable criteria and not to strain CV joints or shafts.
They were designed and manufactured for durability,strength and reliability of not just the spring but everything that works with it or is affected by it.
There's my 2p worth
Russel

[syncropaddy]

Nothing wrong with going to the extremes as long as you realize the limits.Most of us are using these vehicles far beyond their design intentions. We are just lucky they were well engineered.
Another Question for the experts" not meaning this in a nasty way" how many of you have experience with all these different springs and shocks to be able to give full advice.I haven't used Simon's or the trailmaster setups but have used all the others.
I use HD 2WD springs on the front of my doka with other suspension mods,new 16 shock and for its use this works well for me. But it has other mods with these springs.
As usual it has been an experiment from the beginning but is now fine tuned and i am very happy with it.
I have used and fitted a lot of different suspension,tyre setups and give advice from personal experience and knowledge.
The Seikles dont give a lot of lift to a light vehicle ? Reason, to keep the suspension geometry within adjustable criteria and not to strain CV joints or shafts.
They were designed and manufactured for durability,strength and reliability of not just the spring but everything that works with it or is affected by it.
There's my 2p worth
Russel

There is a good question in there Russel, and its "how many of you have experience with all these different springs and shocks to be able to give full advice" ..... answer is NONE OF US! (and that includes you by your own admission)

Remember our vans are at least 17 years old and how many will have had new springs fitted before we got our hands on them ...

How many of us have experienced a brand new Syncro? How many of us have experienced a brand new Syncro Camper? Brand new as in out of the factory ...... and if you were lucky enough can you remember it exactly? No!
Before you ask about spring upgrades you first have to ask 'whats wrong with what I've got' and go back to basics ie. the standard setup, springs, shocks and bushes. Until you go there you wont know where else to go.

I used HD front springs with 16" shocks and I lost all the axle articulation we do have and my teeth rattled. So back to standard and its comfy, handles fine for a garden shed and Im happy with it. THIS is my only experience of feckin about with springs/shocks. I dont have the time to try out truck loads of setups, nor do I have the inclination. You could spend thousands and thousands getting nowhere fast but if thats your game, well then .... enjoy it.

Thats my 2c worth ..... but the problem we have is that we dont have someone who has the ultimate answer ..... we only have our own experience to share.