Club 80-90 Forums

dubuffet wrote:I went to check the Engine number on the block on the oil breather mount... It’s been shaved off!!! all it had left was the number 193 after the logo...

That suggests it is a VW replacement engine
I have the same on my engine
just a vw logo and a number

1.9 oil scraper ring will not fit 2.1. VW Heritage does acknowledge the difference and that they're out of stock.

Just for posterity, I got my liners back onto the pistons without too much bother.
The liners (on mine anyway) had a slight taper at the bottom and I was able to do it with just my fingers compressing the rings. I did have a proper ring compressor at hand but found it was more hassle than it was worth what with the studs getting in the way. Of course if you do break a ring (doing it "my way") you will be sick as a parrot, so take my input here as "informational" not "the way to do it"

Keep the info coming, we like re-build threads, esp if the have a happy outcome, as per this one = https://club8090.co.uk/forum/viewtopic.php?f=37&t=52374" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; which has some more info within that you may find of interest.

toomanytoys wrote:Measure the rings on the piston,,,

But, looking at the pic of the pistons, they look like DJ ones....


VW Heritige list the 2.1 rings as all the same...
I cant check EKTA at the mo...

Machine 7 list
2.1 as 1.75mm, 2mm, 3.5mm,

1.9 as 1.75mm, 2mm, 3.5mm

2.1 is 3.5 mm oil scraper

1.9 is 4 mm oil scraper.

From what I can tell. I have the 1.9 set if anyone is is after a set. £55 KS from Brickwerks. - http://www.brickwerks.co.uk/shop?page=s ... ston+rings

kevtherev wrote:

dubuffet wrote:I went to check the Engine number on the block on the oil breather mount... It’s been shaved off!!! all it had left was the number 193 after the logo...

That suggests it is a VW replacement engine
I have the same on my engine
just a vw logo and a number

Cheers Kev, I think this might be the case..

I noticed crank play, with the flywheel off (to replace oil seal) by hand I noticed there was about 1mm of play.. With the flywheel back on I couldn't feel any play what so ever. What is the correct (without proper tools) way to check for play, flywheel on/off

Evening all, here is a quick update on progress so far.

I have removed the engine. MUCH BETTER!

Gave her bit of a clean....



Found some serious looking pitting in the crank case where the old water has had its fun...

Would my only option here be chemical metal to try and prevent further corrosion and leaking of the crank case? some of it is right on the water jacket contact edge which would explain why the left side water jacket was in worse shape than the right. Thinking I should fill it with the best chem metal I can get and square it off to avoid it eating the new water jacket.

Looks like the flywheel oil seal has gone before. -replaced.


Prior to engine dismantle the vehicle would shudder between gear changes when releasing the clutch.. Trying to figure out where the shudder is coming from. It could be CV,s or Clutch or the fact that there was only three bolts holding the engine to the bell housing!! bottom left stud (closest to cylinder 3) no where to bee seen.
Here are some pics of the clutch.. Its hard to see but all surfaces are smooth but look pretty scorched.


new clutch time and skim?

Glad to see you giving it a good going over

Re- the pitting inside the case, you could try with liquid metal but TBH I wouldn't bother, it is only holding water pressure not compression and if you use the right anti freeze when you re-build I reckon the case will last plenty long enough unless you are planning to hand it down to future generations.

The top of the case/water jacket where the seal sits is an interesting one. Same applies for the mating surface on the head. If it is badly pitted you can use liquid metal to repair, but first I would clean down with a light abrasive or a scotchbrite pad or similar to asses how bad the pitting is. (don't use anything that will remove metal though like a die grinder etc).

If it is only light pitting this will probs be OK as when you reseal the flexible sealant (Reinzosil etc) will fill up these gaps.

Re the clutch, if the flywheel oil seal has gone I would have thought the clutch surface would be contaminated and hence the judder, are they scorch marks or oil marks on the friction plate?

cheers,

MM

dubuffet wrote: 2.1 is 3.5 mm oil scraper

1.9 is 4 mm oil scraper.

Correct

A 2.1 DJ uses the following Mahle rings as OE


A 1.9 DG uses these rings


Difference is the size of the oil control ring.

Interestingly Mahle seem to show two different sets for a DG and the only difference I can see is the materials. Both DG and DJ were also available with a 94.51mm oversize option.

MM

This looks like they have made ring sets with two different different design oil control rings as both appear to live under the same part number??...
Lucky dip as to which gets supplied maybe??

croc wrote:This looks like they have made ring sets with two different different design oil control rings as both appear to live under the same part number??...
Lucky dip as to which gets supplied maybe??

I think the 2.1's part number is 198 175 025A

The 1.9's are 198 175 029

Base on this source. Don't have ETKA .http://www.csp-shop.com/cgi-bin/cshop2/ ... ort=0&all=

Well today I managed to get some time in after work. Pulled piston #2 & #4 via mm289's trick i found here one of his threads https://club8090.co.uk/forum/viewtopic.p ... 6#p7635876 Post number 3.

Here are some pics of the twist and pull method. Glad I never had to try the hammer & heat technique, THANKS MM!!


You can see here the M12 nut, and washer fits like a glove.


Used a large spanner to support the socket/M12 puller against the large curly water pump area on the block for number #4




Come to Papa!

Now, I'm looking at cylinder 3 & 1, I bet those cir-clips are fun up against the crank case with no opening like 4 & 2. I'm guessing my straight cir-clip pliers here are gunna be outta the question.

Going to keep cleaning.... make sure it can all go in easier than it came out. Will post more info after the weekend hopefully with some progress to report of new parts!

Gents!
Thanks for all your input, I have had my hands tied for some time now, but have now got a chance to provide an update on this semi re-build.

After removing the pistons, fitting the new rings and getting it ready to fit back in the van I was also trying to arrange a 12 week EU holiday, quit my job, sell/give/throw my belongings and move into a van that had only just begun to look like this might actually work. So pictures tell a thousands words.

Circlip insurance - it served its purpose in an earlier life.



To put the cylinder liners and pistons back in i traced the inside outline of a new water jacket seal, onto a piece of suitable wood to cut out, thus allowing me put the engine on its side without an engine stand. As I have read here before, use gravity to your advantage when getting to putting the heads on.

things starting to take shape. I used a tiny smear of copper slip on the green and black cylinder liner seals to ensure the cylinder recess edge in the head/bottom of crank case etc, did not cut or damage the seal's sealyness.



New oil cooler and plumbing to boot. Previous owner abandoned that option.

The following day its started to bucket down with rain, so that was fun getting her back in whilst lying in the street. sun came out once all in of course so I took another pic.


So after;

New radiator, new starter motor(not shown above), new shock absorbers all round, new steering rack bushings (awesome!) new piston rings (Seals all round really), heads checked and cleaned, new thermostat housing and thermostat, new cooling junction connector behind engine wall and cylinder 1, New various bits of long lasting plumbing for the cooling system, new exhaust for cylinder 1 and 4, exhaust elbow and seals/bolts etc.

It's running like a dream, which is good I don't really have a choice, have covered 1200 miles so far and deep in Czech country land at the moment, have Poland, Slovakia, Hungary, Bosnia, Serbia, and Croatia on the list before returning back to England.

Have some good info on an amazing T25 workshop I found in Berlin! Got a replacement Pierburg 2E carburetor (vergassa!) at a reasonable price, only needed the accelerator diaphragm but brought the whole thing. so anyone after a replacement Carb let me know. Don't have his address and details on me now but will get round to it when I get time to post all the other info on the car-puter installed for GPS, music and wifi etc.

Signing off for now.



Cheers,

Dre.

Awesome,glad you are putting all that hard work to good use. Loads of people get put off doing the hard yards and rebuilding these themselves, but I would much rather trust my own work than someone who i don't know

Having rebuilt the engine (which is running sweeet BTW) I am now heavily into body repairs.....

Post up some pics of your travels, would be good to see you in all these far flung lands

MM

mm289 wrote:Awesome,glad you are putting all that hard work to good use. Loads of people get put off doing the hard yards and rebuilding these themselves, but I would much rather trust my own work than someone who i don't know

Having rebuilt the engine (which is running sweeet BTW) I am now heavily into body repairs.....

Post up some pics of your travels, would be good to see you in all these far flung lands

MM

CROATIA

And there it is... The T25 "head gasket"