Exposed Flywheel...is it a problem?

[PC52]

...can i ask where do these dowels go? what do they do?

The dowels go on the bell housing and the conversion plate so basically when you bolt it together it pulls it central and stays there. Should be based on the conversion plate and then marry to the bell housing. Which in effect should create a true central. (if it's right)

The majority of the time if you look at a standard diesel setup you will see the dowels sticking out - 9 out of 10 times on the engine side probably about 10mm plus. Then they marry up to the gearbox which ensures a tight fit.

Trouble with a VW petrol engine is that the dowel is the complete circumference on the engine side - it has a lip all the way round, so when the gearbox and engine are joined nothing moves. It works on a petrol but then using the petrol bell housing on a diesel. VW diesel bellhousings are doweled I think possibly 2, 1 left and 1 right level with sump line. VW diesel bell housing is also secured wth 7 bolts double the thickness of a petrol bell housing, it all comes down to torque.

Forgot earlier, the hole for the vw starter needs to be capped off as you are using the pug starter.

But before you go any further you really need to ensure engine and gearbox are absolute plumb in lne.

[andysimpson]

But before you go any further you really need to ensure engine and gearbox are absolute plumb in lne.

Best thing to do is drop it straight in a skip and put something better in there which bolts up properly

[BigGirther]

do you just go around lookin for folk working on pug conversions then slag off everything theyre doing?

[andysimpson]

do you just go around lookin for folk working on pug conversions then slag off everything there doing?

Yes cos i have yet to see one which looks like an ok conversion, certainly a waste of time and effort when a vw diesel will fit in on standard engine mounts and bell housing and use everything as standard and not bodged engine mounts, coolant hoses, flywheel clutches, and no nasty adaptor plates.

The question i really have is why use a pug engine other than every scrap yard has lots of them.

[BigGirther]

ill come show you mine when its done then
in mean time might as well be constructive or not say anything at all instead of turning every pug topic into a debate with your one liners

[andysimpson]

ill come show you mine when its done then
in mean time might as well be constructive or not say anything at all instead of turning every pug topic into a debate with your one liners

Like i say when i see a good one which matches the standard of any of the numerous vw diesel D/TD/TDI engines which bolt straight in with no bodges to clutch bellhousing or engine mounts or cooling system, i will stop slagging them of until then everyone nows my view on the subject. Many people on forums have very different views and everyone is entitled to their say.

You never ansered the question of why. When i understand this i might see a plus side to the pug conversion other than they are very easy to get.

[PC52]

Now then, before we start goin and throwing engines around

If it's right then it works. If it doesn't then it's complete gearbox muncher

What you have to think about is the family is off on the hols, T25 pug conversion middle of spain (you create the scenario) clutch gets a wobble on, what is it VW? Pug? 1/2 & 1/2 ?
Besides that what garage would touch it even if they understood?

In all fairness to Andy (and me) he has actually seen first hand the conversion and tried to make it work, it didn't. We spent alot of time modifying and adapting to tidy up and make it work without throwing anymore money at it just wasn't worth the hassle.

[BigGirther]

I admit its not fair to say to someone that their point isn't valid and i apologise, just thinking about having to get a different engine with all that work and all that money just got me back up at the time.
Well ill see how it goes and hope for the best

[PC52]

Fair play to you mate, understand where your coming from.
That's what a forum is for and people like us pop along with advice & ideas.
With better engineering on the adaptor plate then this conversion may be viable. See what's what happens when you split it apart.

[andysimpson]

With better engineering on the adaptor plate then this conversion may be viable. See what's what happens when you split it apart.

Engine mounts are always way to close together which puts alot of stress on adaptor plate, they need moving apart/making neater.

[famous phil]

With better engineering on the adaptor plate then this conversion may be viable. See what's what happens when you split it apart.

Engine mounts are always way to close together which puts alot of stress on adaptor plate, they need moving apart/making neater.

engine mounts been close does not make to much difference as engine is mounted inline not transverse , I've put loads of stress on them when testing driving forward at 30mph then dropping the bus into reverse and ripping the tyres to bits only snapping a bolt in the adapter that was not to strong so use 8.8 or 10.9 bolts ,,,,,,,,,,,

Back to the exposed flywheel the adapter is drilled and threaded for the flywheel cover plate from the peugeot

[camper]

Pleased to see you are back on the forum famous phil.Question can you supply a adapter plate kit for the pug conversion with a diesel bell housing.Interested in doing a pug 2.1 hdi engine conversion. http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll? ... escription" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; Nothing to do with me but interesting.Question&answers about who did the conversion and the flywheel half&half VW/Pug.

[andysimpson]

With better engineering on the adaptor plate then this conversion may be viable. See what's what happens when you split it apart.

Engine mounts are always way to close together which puts alot of stress on adaptor plate, they need moving apart/making neater.

engine mounts been close does not make to much difference as engine is mounted inline not transverse , I've put loads of stress on them when testing driving forward at 30mph then dropping the bus into reverse and ripping the tyres to bits only snapping a bolt in the adapter that was not to strong so use 8.8 or 10.9 bolts ,,,,,,,,,,,

Back to the exposed flywheel the adapter is drilled and threaded for the flywheel cover plate from the peugeot

Pete did real world testing as well and cracked the left engine mounting. The left one is only used as an engine steady support when fitted in pugs.

[PC52]

Yep it was in the real world.
A trip to northumberland limited to 50mph 'cos of massive clutch slip arrived home and gearbox oil everywhere
Ripped it out the following day and the damage caused is in the earlier pics.

Question&answers about who did the conversion and the flywheel half&half VW/Pug.

The conversion was done on a syncro previous to my ownership, I was told by the previous owner that it was a famous phil conversion.
We spent a mammoth amount of time trying to get it to work, solved the engine mounting issue and got it onto genuine vw diesel bars and rubbers but the movement just couldn't be stopped and ate spiggot shafts.

Pug project abandoned and upright MTDI was fitted and has been for 3+ years with no problems and a massive amount of miles.

[famous phil]

Hi , not sure what you mean by "did real world testing " I used to do over 22,000 hard miles a year in my t25 work van , a pal has done over 120,000 miles in his t25 and that engine had done over 200k before fitting ,,, I've never cracked one of them engine mounts even after they've had part cut away where the peugeot drive shaft went through ,, I've had my camper for eight years and has been no bother ,,,,,,,, I had someone complain about one of my kits once before and on the guy showing me his engine I could see strait away that it was not one of my kits but made very much the same ,,, I used to have the end of an engine block but now have half an engine block at the engineers that the plates get checked on , have a batch made at the moment and have checked them all and are spot on , Andy it would be good to find something good enough to fit strait in on the standard VW box
"Camper guy" can supply adapter kit , ,, is it the 2.1 multy valve engine or the later HDI , I know you say HDi but just to be sure ,,,

Regards Phil