starter motor problem

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tee3peeo
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starter motor problem

Post by tee3peeo »

Hi, this is a tricky question and I would be grateful for advice - a year ago I fitted this early type starter to my van

http://www.vwheritage.com/vw_spares_Sta ... tartPage=1

To be fair to the starter I note that it has been commented that
''most reported faults in new starter operation are due to old wiring from the ignition switch producing low voltage at the starter motor solenoid. You can check if non-operation is due to a wiring issue by testing with a feed direct from the battery. If in doubt then seek professional advice.''

and - I didn't fit a new bush - I didn't think I had to with this type of starter.
So - is any of the above likely to be causing the problem?
When I bite the bush and change it - can I put in the later type
like this?

http://www.brickwerks.co.uk/index.php/s ... -2544.html

as I don't want to fit the same one if I can avoid it - are there alternative suppliers for the early type?
Will I need to fit a bush with the newer starter if it can be fitted?

Any comments/ideas very gratefully received

Zeb
1985 14" DG Syncro

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bigherb
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Re: starter motor problem

Post by bigherb »

You should have fitted a new bush with either type of motor.
The only difference between the early and late starters is the length of the battery lead mounting stud. You can fit the later to early models, but not the other way round unless you modify the wiring.
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Re: starter motor problem

Post by ghost123uk »

Just to confirm what BH says ^^^

tee3peeo wrote: and - I didn't fit a new bush - I didn't think I had to with this type of starter.

VWheritage wrote:A new armature bush (113-301-155) must be fitted into the gearbox when fitting.

:wink:

One of those jobs that can cause a lot of swearing. Best done on a ramp, in the warm and dry ;) Info in our "wiki" all about it.
Got a new van, but it's a 165bhp T4 [shock horror] Accurate LPG Station map here

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tee3peeo
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Re: starter motor problem

Post by tee3peeo »

many thanks bigherb and ghost123uk
I can see that the bush was a blunder, and I think I will wind up fitting a later starter (with a bush) - but in your experience, is that likely to cause the sort of problem I'm experiencing or is it possible that the wiring to the solenoid could be tricky?

Zeb
1985 14" DG Syncro

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bigherb
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Re: starter motor problem

Post by bigherb »

No idea you haven't told us what the problem you are having is, or what engine and year it is.
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tee3peeo
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Re: starter motor problem

Post by tee3peeo »

Oh - it fell off the end of the text
1985 Syncro DG transporter

I fitted the starter about a year ago - at first it worked well, but very quickly started to stick, and at times just click to make matters worse a bolt fell out the back of the solenoid casing after about a month. All of this stopped after a couple of months - but just recently it only works about 50% of the time, on the others, turn the switch and nothing - I can't see a pattern to it either.

thanks
Zeb

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bigherb
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Re: starter motor problem

Post by bigherb »

The first thing to do is fit a new starter bush. The lead from the ignition switch has the turn the starter into engagement first, if the bush is worn then it will take more current to energise the starter which is over 30A on a good day.
Soak the new bush in engine oil for 24hrs before you fit it. That will eliminate one problem.
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tee3peeo
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Re: starter motor problem

Post by tee3peeo »

ok, many thanks - I will try it
Zeb
1985 14" DG Syncro

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ermie571
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Re: starter motor problem

Post by ermie571 »

Zeb, I'm a girlie and I changed my bush!

Without the aid of ramps. Moderate swearing, and NO plasters!!


I did it from the engine bay pretty much by feel.

BUT....please have a bit of rag with you to block the hole through which the bush can fall and you can't retrieve it.

Its a slippery slimey bugger when soaked in oil.. Another tip was to freeze it to get it to contract..it then became a bloody cold, slippery slimey bugger!

Good luck.
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Re: starter motor problem

Post by ghost123uk »

tee3peeo wrote: I fitted the starter about a year ago - at first it worked well, but very quickly started to stick, and at times just click to make matters worse a bolt fell out the back of the solenoid casing after about a month. All of this stopped after a couple of months - but just recently it only works about 50% of the time, on the others, turn the switch and nothing.

IMHO, I don't think a new bush will fix that ^^^, but it needs doing anyway ;)

To fix that ^^^ you just need to be methodical. There have been recent similar threads on here, do bit of digging and you will see lots of mention of worn out end connectors on the very heavy cables that can cause problems. Also the actual ignition key switch has been known to fail. A multimeter is your friend there. Also the thin "trigger" wire that connects to the solenoid can suffer from poor connections at the solenoid end (it's a "Lucar" spade connector).

Mind you, you say that after you first fitted it, after a while it just clicked sometimes. That click is of course the solenoid working, but the stater not working and that can be caused by ANY of the very heavy wires being in need of attention (including the earth one from the gearbox to chassis, assuming a Syncro has that in the "normal" place ;)

So, you just have to work your way through all the likely suspects, cables, switch, battery voltage, earths, etc.
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tee3peeo
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Re: starter motor problem

Post by tee3peeo »

ok, got it, - thanks for that ghost123uk - the truth is the starter on my van is pretty inaccessible and I will have to take off some stuff and drop the transaxle a bit to get at any of it - tbh I was hoping that a two minute piece of pixie dust needed polishing but I have dusted off the axle stands. I've checked the wiki and that's pretty straight forward and Ive seen some of the posts you mentioned - I just need to get at the blinking thing - here goes.... :D
1985 14" DG Syncro

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