Newbie buying a T25. Do they all rot/engine/gbox?

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Piratepete
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Newbie buying a T25. Do they all rot/engine/gbox?

Post by Piratepete »

Hi Guys
I know what I'm after - 90/91 Pop Top with the 2.1L Petrol Injection engine.
Questions - I know your answers will probably start with 'Well,it all depends..' but please do your best!

1. What's the life of a 2.1 injection engine without any serious work on it? Is it 100k miles or 150k or 200k miles? In other words,would you worry about a van with the original engine at say 150,000 miles?

2. I thought a late model would be a safe bet as far as rot is concerned, but my local garage has told me otherwise - they just MOTd a 1990 model which required £1000 of welding first!
So would you be more inclined to buy a 1990 van that's never had any welding done and is said to be immaculate or a 1990 van that's had extensive work done in say 2012?

3. Auto or Manual gearbox? Any preference or comments?

Thanks in advance for all useful replies.

Cheers!
Pete

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itchyfeet
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Re: Newbie buying a T25. Do they all rot/engine/gbox?

Post by itchyfeet »

1. Yes but chances are it's not original, no guarantees even with a recent rebuild unless the rebuild was upwards of 3K it will be a repaired engine and plenty of horror stories of rebuilds/repaired engines at £1500 not lasting long. Sooner or later you will need to budget for a decent rebuild or learn yourself ( google WBXLog)

2. Age is not guide to rust, a van kept outside on the coast in Wales will be a rot box, a van imported from California could be almost rust free. Welding is rarely done well so any van with lots of welding or a recent respray avoid ( nobody resprays a van to sell it unless it's rotten) , really the condition of the body should be your No1 van choice over almost anything else, everything else bolts on and almost everything is available, good welders are very rare and very expensive.

3. Manual, nobody seems to know anything about auto gearboxes so if it breaks then it's another old second hand jobbie if you can find one, Manual gearbox rebuilders are in good supply.

Good Luck :ok
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Re: Newbie buying a T25. Do they all rot/engine/gbox?

Post by silverbullet »

Without an unbroken service record and paperwork to back it up after it left main dealer care, I would say that 100k is about the expected lifespan of a wbx before they wear the camshaft and go off song (oil service intervals and using oil of the correct type is essential) but...lots of motorway driving and garaging vs. infrequent use and being parked in damp fields is also a factor.
Low mileage is not always a good thing.
They are expensive to rebuild properly and frequently aren't, many "re-cons" are merely recycled.

Yes they all rust, in the same places, to a greater or lesser degree. Front valance, lower A posts, cab steps, lower B posts, sill ends, rear arch seams, tailgate lower lip.

Autos are supposed to last really well, but the manual box is less so. All depends on previous ownership, frequency of cold useage and driving style.

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Re: Newbie buying a T25. Do they all rot/engine/gbox?

Post by dbz864 »

I wouldn't agree with itchy feets comment, nobody resprays a van to sell unless its rotten. From memory I've sold 2/3 t25s without painting, many many more I've had full paint jobs on, probably only one one of those was a bit "pooh". Dont be put off by a resprayed van, yes be put off by a badly resprayed van. Look very carefully at each van, you are buying an old vehicle.buy right and you will be ok, a bad buy will bankrupt you. The idea of buying a van in its original coat that looks very good is pie in the sky.
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Piratepete
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Re: Newbie buying a T25. Do they all rot/engine/gbox?

Post by Piratepete »

Thanks!
Pete

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itchyfeet
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Re: Newbie buying a T25. Do they all rot/engine/gbox?

Post by itchyfeet »

dbz864 wrote:I wouldn't agree with itchy feets comment, nobody resprays a van to sell unless its rotten. From memory I've sold 2/3 t25s without painting, many many more I've had full paint jobs on, probably only one one of those was a bit "pooh". Dont be put off by a resprayed van, yes be put off by a badly resprayed van. Look very carefully at each van, you are buying an old vehicle.buy right and you will be ok, a bad buy will bankrupt you. The idea of buying a van in its original coat that looks very good is pie in the sky.


It's not the quality of the respray that is the problem but the rust underneath, almost impossible to get rust out of seams and often rusting inside out so somebody sprays over it and it looks great for the buyer but rust comes back through a year later.

No most vans don't have original paint ( I have one with 75% of panels original paint and it's almost worn through to primer in places) but one with fresh paint is more of a risk that one that was painted years ago.
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Re: Newbie buying a T25. Do they all rot/engine/gbox?

Post by dbz864 »

itchyfeet wrote:
dbz864 wrote:I wouldn't agree with itchy feets comment, nobody resprays a van to sell unless its rotten. From memory I've sold 2/3 t25s without painting, many many more I've had full paint jobs on, probably only one one of those was a bit "pooh". Dont be put off by a resprayed van, yes be put off by a badly resprayed van. Look very carefully at each van, you are buying an old vehicle.buy right and you will be ok, a bad buy will bankrupt you. The idea of buying a van in its original coat that looks very good is pie in the sky.


It's not the quality of the respray that is the problem but the rust underneath, almost impossible to get rust out of seams and often rusting inside out so somebody sprays over it and it looks great for the buyer but rust comes back through a year later.

No most vans don't have original paint ( I have one with 75% of panels original paint and it's almost worn through to primer in places) but one with fresh paint is more of a risk that one that was painted years ago.
I was referring to your comment nobody resprays a van to sell unless its rotten. Which is clearly incorrect, I respray Van's to sell, I dont do this because its rotten, there are many different ways to repair bodywork, many weekend mechanics make mistakes when trying to repair things. I agree a badly repaired body which is badly painted is a recipe for disaster
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Re: Newbie buying a T25. Do they all rot/engine/gbox?

Post by philyoung »

I’m no expert but thoughts;
1. My van was a German riot police ambulance that clearly did a lot of autobahn miles at high revs - engine keeled over at 150,000km but the gearbox still pretty much pristine.
2. Rot depends on how it’s been kept not age, mines a 1990, not perfect but largely original paint, but German public service means always garaged and very good care. Later this year it’s going to get the dents/dings/scratches etc, sorted and will be resprayed, the whole original paint thing is all very well but how far to take it? At some point all old vehicles are going to need work or they’ll fall apart.
3. No idea about autos, Aidan Talbot the man for manual gearboxes not sure if he does autos.
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Re: Newbie buying a T25. Do they all rot/engine/gbox?

Post by philyoung »

And I might add the 2.5 ‘improved’ Oettinger from 025motorsport is a great drive if your 2.1 falls over..
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Re: Newbie buying a T25. Do they all rot/engine/gbox?

Post by Ecopod »

I'll echo above comments, bodywork is priority number 1, 2 and 3. Any van showing signs of rusty seams will be a lot worse behind the panel. Key is to get under / in / around every van you look at, and you may look at a few. Any genuine seller will have no problem with you taking along a set of ramps etc so you can get a really good inspection (ramps £40 - poor T25 £000's).

If you are prepared to take on some work there always seem to be 'projects' for sale on fleabay etc. My last two T25's both came via this route, both were rolling shells with every panel visible inside and outside, everything else was in boxes. Both had panels repaired to what seemed to be a very good standard, one was resprayed the other (just parked in my garage this weekend) is rubbed down ready for painting (I plan to roller paint for £200).

I had some mechanical experience but by no means anything approaching expert level. Rebuilding a project can be done in a single garage, mostly with simple tools and there is a wealth of experience to fall back on right here (and I did). End result can be a very reasonably priced T25 that you know every inch of and a better chance of sorting out anything that goes wrong down the line (and it probably will).

Good luck with your search.
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Re: Newbie buying a T25. Do they all rot/engine/gbox?

Post by DoubleOSeven »

Some notes here for you, PiratePete:

http://wiki.club8090.co.uk/index.php/Mi ... yers_guide" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
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Re: Newbie buying a T25. Do they all rot/engine/gbox?

Post by 100leelee »

Speaking from my own experiences...

Engine, all depends on history... no service history at all, expect issues..

Bodywork, expect the worst, even from good looking original vans. My van looked ‘ok’ but once you start digging you will find rust to some degree. Mine was pretty bad. After spending over a year removing said rust and welding new steel in, its not for the faint hearted for sure.
Check jacking points, all four corners, sliding door rails, lower and middle..

There’s a lot of knowledgeable people on here.. use them is my suggestion!!

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