Starter motor/electrics?

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sneakyalien
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Starter motor/electrics?

Post by sneakyalien »

Hia all,
I Picked my van (T25 1.9 petrol high top)up from the repair guy(new mot, new fuel pipes,dash off for new blower etc) on the way home I noticed the battery light flickering at low revs. Anyways, it got me home and then it would not start. Then it did and then would not again. Now it won't turn over at all. I tried to jump start it with leads from my car, but still nothing. It is like the starter motor tries to turn, but either tries or just nothing and a click sound. Any ideas what it could be? Is it my starter motor? I gave it a little bang with a hammer, but still nothing.
Thanks

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DoubleOSeven
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Re: Starter motor/electrics?

Post by DoubleOSeven »

Try swapping out the relay
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sneakyalien
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Re: Starter motor/electrics?

Post by sneakyalien »

When I turn the ignition key I can hear a clicking sound coming from the fuse box that is in the glove box and I can see the relays which make a click sound.

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937carrera
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Re: Starter motor/electrics?

Post by 937carrera »

DoubleOSeven wrote:Try swapping out the relay

I didn't think there is a starter relay fitted as standard on a DG. There is the terminal X relief relay, (which is what the OP will be able to hear) but that's nothing to with the circuit for the starter.

Wiring diagram here, http://syncrosport.com/info/wiring/VW_T ... _SP_DG.pdf

Some people add a starter relay as a mod, which I find kind of amusing as then you've got a relay triggering another relay (AKA starter solenoid).
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937carrera
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Re: Starter motor/electrics?

Post by 937carrera »

Back to the OP question, simple things first, are you sure the battery terminals are on securely and battery well charged ? Poor battery earth can also give these symptoms.

From reading other posts I think there is a blue exciter wire pm some T25's from alternator to starter, if that breaks or gets corroded the alternator doesn't work. On the DG I think the connection is from the alternator to main fusebox, via a terminal connector in the engine fusebox and it's that that feeds the warning light.

http://forum.club8090.co.uk/viewtopic.p ... &t=145489&

Last post in that thread takes you to Samba which has pictures and the wiring diagram

Do you have a multimeter ?
1981 RHD 2.0 Aircooled Leisuredrive project, CU engine
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sneakyalien
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Re: Starter motor/electrics?

Post by sneakyalien »

Yes, I tightened the clamps on the battery terminals. I also had jump leads from my car onto the battery terminals and it made no difference. I put a volt meter on the terminals and it was about 13 volts.
It tried to turn over for about a second, a a very faint attempt like a quarter of a revolution and then just nothing.

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937carrera
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Re: Starter motor/electrics?

Post by 937carrera »

Next step is earth off the battery, solenoid connection disconnected, earth back on, test for voltage at the solenoid cable while someone else turns the ignition key. The tailgate latch is usually a decent earth point to use. Check also using engine as the earth, this will test the earth strap for the engine.

You've got 13V at the battery, double check battery positive to a good chassis earth, if that's the same then the battery earth is OK
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Sir Brixalot
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Re: Starter motor/electrics?

Post by Sir Brixalot »

Are you saying the hard start relay upgrade is pointless?
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937carrera
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Re: Starter motor/electrics?

Post by 937carrera »

Sir Brixalot wrote:Are you saying the hard start relay upgrade is pointless?

No I didn't say that, it does reduce the current going through the ignition switch, if you believe that is a problem.

The beauty of the original wiring is that there is nothing else to go wrong so you're exchanging one possible failure mode (low voltage due to deteriorated wiring / contacts) for another (relay failure). If people want to fit one then it's fine by me, it's their van :)

As I said, I just find it amusing, maybe because I see the starter solenoid as a relay (which is its function) rather than some other component.
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Re: Starter motor/electrics?

Post by Sir Brixalot »

I changed the cable from alternator to starter. Getting 14.25v at battery with engine running. I was going to do the main starter cable.

1. With 14.25v at battery is it still worth changing big cable?

2. I got under camper but can't see where the cable exits from the battery - is it above the fuel tank?

3. If I go ahead with changing main batterycable, do I just cut the existing battery cable and pull it through the floor of the cab and create a new route back to the starter?

thanks for all putting up with a barrage of questions.
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937carrera
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Re: Starter motor/electrics?

Post by 937carrera »

14.25v at the battery is absolutely fine, one could almost say perfect.

Your call but if it ain't broke I wouldn't go fixing it (in the kindest possible way, especially after reading about your LPG cable pruning this morning - it's not a shrub, it won't grow back :rofl )
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bigherb
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Re: Starter motor/electrics?

Post by bigherb »

Sir Brixalot wrote: 1. With 14.25v at battery is it still worth changing big cable?
Probably not, 14.25V is good.

Sir Brixalot wrote: 2. I got under camper but can't see where the cable exits from the battery - is it above the fuel tank?

Yes, and usually cable tied to the throttle cable conduit above the tank so you cant just pull it through.

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Sir Brixalot
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Re: Starter motor/electrics?

Post by Sir Brixalot »

Right. I've renewed the red cable to the box in the engine bay. The blue alternator exciter/trigger wire had various bodges in it so I thought I'd replace it. There is 11.65v at the junction but when I fitted 8 amp cable it remains constant right to the lug which will be attached to the alternator. But when I attach it to the alternator I get 1.41 on lug/alternator post and at junction in engine bay

Any ideas? I just can't fathom it out
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bigherb
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Re: Starter motor/electrics?

Post by bigherb »

Sir Brixalot wrote:Right. I've renewed the red cable to the box in the engine bay. The blue alternator exciter/trigger wire had various bodges in it so I thought I'd replace it. There is 11.65v at the junction but when I fitted 8 amp cable it remains constant right to the lug which will be attached to the alternator. But when I attach it to the alternator I get 1.41 on lug/alternator post and at junction in engine bay

Any ideas? I just can't fathom it out

If you are talking about the blue exciter wire that should happen, the dashboard resistors are dropping the voltage. The exciter lug is earth until it starts charging, then is alternator output voltage.
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Sir Brixalot
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Re: Starter motor/electrics?

Post by Sir Brixalot »

Thanks. Makes perfect sense. Oly 13.75 today at battery with engine running when it was 14.25v the other day-I'll have to check other connections
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