T25 1986 automatic gearbox problem

[maxstu]

Sorry for the radio silence and thanks for the replies. All very interesting . So today the van had full diagnostics at NW Transmissions. This is what they've said... The van has a cracked bell housing and needs the gearbox torque convertor replacing along with the flexplate.
They've said if we source parts they can do the work for £1000 (estimate) but can't guarantee the job.
Any suggestions? What would you do?
Thanks, as always

Just recapping on some posts. As l said. The diff case is not that bad. And certainly not the cause of your noisy gearbox unless a small piece of loose casing is jammed inside and hitting flexplate or the TC.

Then on to NW Transmissions. A grand is top end price for labour alone. Two hours max to take out box by professionals. Two hours doing preventative maintenance replacing seals and gaskets. Three hour to go back in, allowing for run up and coolant check. Seven hours for a £1000. That's Central London prices!

But if needs must...

Torque convertor. Pxssed l sold my spare for £100.

https://ebay.us/m/XKQhvF

Spare used flexplate sitting on my shelf. Sourced brand they are plus £300. Yours for £80.00 plus postage.



I suggest you have the cooler seals replaced and both facing seal between diff and transmission changed.

[LittleNik]

Thanks again, you've been an amazing support! So we've turned down the gearbox I posted photos of. My husband said that the van was driving okay-ish aside from the awful noise, when he took it to the garage so it seems to be changing up through the gears (although reverse has been dodgy since we bought it tbh).

Now investigating the possibility of repairs rather than replacing the whole gearbox but still need to do more digging and find someone reliable locally to do the work. Thanks for your offer of the part, really kind of you!

So here's the email from NW Transmissions when I asked for the diagnostic report... 'The cracks have appeared around the bellhousing area, where the gearbox meets the engine. One of which looks like a previous weld that has failed. The damage is causing the torque converter to 'rub' against the assembly which is causing the noise. The reason we have advised for a torque converter and flex-plate, is because after expending labour to remove the gearbox you will likely find damage to both components, although those parts aren't guaranteed to be damaged because at this point, without spending labour to remove the gearbox we won't know for certain. It is worth sourcing a torque converter and a flex plate to make sure you are not stuck needing those parts once the gearbox is off.'

They've been really helpful tbh, taking photos we requested and allowing us to keep the van there while we source a gearbox. Reviews are all great. I'm going to ask if we can get a photo of the transmission oil from them as you mentioned. That said, the thought of paying £1000 with no work guaranteed and a pure take one box off, fit the other, then hands off is worrying me... Your costings were interesting.

So, I guess we need to find someone who could tackle a repair of this kind... Any suggestions? Is there a thread on here I could post to?

[maxstu]

Good and not so good news.

However, getting NWT to photo oil colour is pointless now if the cause is external as they suggest. They should change ATF as part of the repair anyhow. And the transaxle oil too.
So in a nutshell NWT diagnosis is either the flexplate or the TC (or both?) is rubbing against the damaged casing. This rubbing may have damage either or both. A tough call. Personally, l think both would be fine to reuse. The flexplate is easy to visually inspect or see damage. The TC is another matter. But NWT will need to remove transmission from engine to diagnose 100%.
That casing has been poorly repaired. But unless something, or some part of the case has come adift, why would it start catching now? Can NWT repair case? It needs working by a cast iron specialist welder. Can they suggest a mobile firm.
I understand NWT suggestion you source parts first (and despite you shelling out 500 quids, the parts may not be needed though! ) They sound as if they are simply going to fit replacement parts and just bolt it back together without rectifying the problem. Then declare no comeback or warranty?
Not sure what to advise now. There is a spare flexplate here. And torque convertors are available in America.

Ask NWT how they intend to prevent case damaging replacement parts. And, yeah, get a photo of ATF fluid to post on here. But do so while present at the vehicle to be certain they are taking a sample from your vehicle. Ask to meet again at their premises to discuss options and welding. Then pop the request for a photo of ATF oil.

Good luck

[LittleNik]

Thanks for your advice, as always, it's so very helpful.

I think we're going to try to find a specialist welder and mechanic who works regularly on these vehicles. Can anybody here recommend anyone in the NW not too far from Liverpool?

I think you're right, NWT just intend to bolt on a replacement. The hassle we've had so far in trying to find a gearbox that isn't in a worse state than ours for less than £1000 makes me feel we should attempt a repair first. NWT are purely gearbox fitters, I don't think they'd entertain any kind of major welding repairs or tricky jobs on vintage vans.

Like you say, whatever happens next it's going to take removal of the gearbox to see what the damage is for certain. I think we may be taking you up on the offer of your part, thanks, I'll be in touch.

Probably our next step is to get the van back home. I'll photograph the oil then and post it.

[maxstu]

Thanks for your advice, as always, it's so very helpful.

I think we're going to try to find a specialist welder and mechanic who works regularly on these vehicles. Can anybody here recommend anyone in the NW not too far from Liverpool?

I think you're right, NWT just intend to bolt on a replacement. The hassle we've had so far in trying to find a gearbox that isn't in a worse state than ours for less than £1000 makes me feel we should attempt a repair first. NWT are purely gearbox fitters, I don't think they'd entertain any kind of major welding repairs or tricky jobs on vintage vans.

Like you say, whatever happens next it's going to take removal of the gearbox to see what the damage is for certain. I think we may be taking you up on the offer of your part, thanks, I'll be in touch.

Probably our next step is to get the van back home. I'll photograph the oil then and post it.

I agree with you. Get your camper home again for now and post oil colour on here. It's condition is important. Photo immediately after drive home so it is warmed up. Remove level stick with engine RUNNING and gearbox in P. Handbrake fully on.
If you have a driveway, find a competent local mobile mechanical who is a little familiar with these vehicles and pay for the transmission to be removed.
The removal of the transmission is fairly simple. Just blooming awkward and heavy. Lots of owners' have done this on their driveway, providing it is solid and fairly even.... not saying you should attempt it yourself, though. But this is the procedure, so you can discuss your requirements with a bit of foreknowledge.
Raise vehicle by about 6 inches and secure. Two trolley jacks. Six bolts each side for the driveshafts. Three bolts separating flexplate from TC. Four engine mounting bolts. Four transmission nose bolts. Clamp the two coolant pipes. They can be a bit awkward to release. Finally, one earth strap and the auto shift/accelerator linkage, and out it comes. No more than two or three hours work for a pro. £250 cash?

Tempted by a nice cuppa of tea. But l'm 300 miles away.

Keep posting. A forum user nearer to you may come to your rescue.

[LittleNik]

Thanks again! So grateful to you for your sound advice and for putting up with my lack of knowledge!

So, better news today... We've found a recommended VW specialist not too far away who has checked out the photos and report from NWT. He has a gearbox in bits suitable for use with our existing gearbox for a recondition/rebuild and it would have a warranty! I've asked for the seals, oil etc to be changed too. Mechanic is really understanding and knowledgeable, clearly knows what he's doing and talks a lot of sense. Good price too!

I'll update on here

[maxstu]

Okay and good luck. You'll be back on the road in no time. Plus advising other forum users ' how to maintain their camper's auto box. Legend!
Be certain the old parts come back to you, unless the agreement is the specialist retains them for future rebuild.

Happy campervanning

[LittleNik]

Haha! I'm already impressing the family with my knowledge of flex plates and torque converters. Think the guy at the garage thought I knew what I was on about. If only he knew...

Fingers crossed it goes according to plan. Can't wait to get on the road again. Thanks for the tip about keeping the old parts, I wouldn't have thought of that.

I'll let you know how it goes. Thanks again for being such a fountain of knowledge!

[maxstu]

Good luck.
Flex plates and torque convertors over afternoon tea.
Who would have thought it?
Keep the forum posted on progress. And if the diff case is exchanged l would be willing to purchase it...even with that damage.
I have a project in mind. And your case is far better than my spare.

[silverbullet]

Just in case it hasn't already been highlighted, when you replace a driveplate (or flywheel) on a wbx you *must* check the engine crankshaft endfloat and adjust as required with shims which may or may not be damaged and equally may or may not be available.
I would always advise renewing the rear thrust washers whilst in there if it is a late wbx.
0.07mm is the figure you want to see on a dial indicator aka three thou' in old money.