Replaced starter motor, solenoid click, not turning over?

[Deaks]

1.9 Petrol on F with a more recent engine.

Started wouldn't turn yesterday, even with a jump, called AA and they found that a short braided cable running from solenoid to the side of the starter had coroded and broken. We got the van started by shoving a screwdriver in there and I got home ok but now need to fix it.

Is it just a case of replacing a wire, or is it something integral to the starter or solenoid that's a more complicated fix?

It's very difficult to see what's going on in that area.

[R0B]

its not a job you are going to be able to do with the starter in situ.remove the starter.give it a good dose of looking at.you may end up having to get another starter.or take yours to an auto electrician.to have the wire replaced.

[Mocki]

i have in the past tinned and soldered this wire up, to get out of trouble, but its a bugger to do, and you need the right equipment, and like rob says it not a job you can do without removing it....

correct course of action would be to take to autoelectricians or re-winders to repair, or replace starter complete.

[Deaks]

Cheers, thought that might be the case. Have ordered new starter and hoping for decent weather tomorrow to fit it.

[VWCamperfan]

I had exactly this a few days ago but luckily there was just enough braided cable inside to cut of the bad bits and solder back on to tag... Not every day I have a blob of solder the size of a broad bean in front of me but it did work. Have now protected the offending material and seems to be ok but got a little problem with the bush now, hay-ho!

[Deaks]

Changed the starter this evening by torchlight, didn't go too badly. Tried starting the van and the solenoid clicks but started doesn't turn. Might be the battery so I've got it on charge but is there anything it could be?

[Deaks]

Right, doing my nut now. Battery fully charged, but still nothing. It's just as if the main power cable isn't attached. The solenoid clicks but nothing happens. Took the main feed wire off and gave the crimp a good clean but still nothing.

Tried something else a bit off the wall, made sense to me but be gentle if it's a stupid idea. I took off the main feed wire and ran a jump lead from the battery + to the bolt on the solenoid. Made no difference, turned key and solenoid still just clicked.

Can the starter be tested off the engine? I'm starting to think I've been sold a duff one.

[VWCamperfan]

That jump lead you have may just be useful... Run the jump lead from the + connector on the starter motor (the one with the thick red wire attached to it) and touch the other end for a second or two on the connector that has the braided wire running into the motor itself (about an inch away from the main battery feed connection you just connected the other end to!). If the motor turns (which it now should as you have bypassed the solenoid) then the problem lies with the solenoid itself, probably the connections inside that make the circuit when you turn the ignition key.
If it doesnt turn then the problem is more than likely the motor itself but before kicking everything in sight and swearing enough to empty your bank balance into the swear box, check the engine earth connection from the gearbox. As a quick bypass, connect your jump lead from the chassis to a bolt head on the motor and see if that makes a difference.
You need a good connection to pass the current from the motor to earth but a dodgy earth can make just the solenoid click and nowt else.
Hoping this helps!

[VWCamperfan]

Just knocked this up, may be useful...



Jump connection 4 to 6. This will bypass the solenoid and test the motor.
Check braid at 6, can corrode.
If solenoid is clicking then you have power going to connection 5.

[Deaks]

Ahh, that makes more sense to me now. All I did earlier was supply power to the outside of the solenoid using the jumper cable. Makes no difference if the solenoid isn't making the connection when it's activated. What I need to do is figure some way to check if power is coming out of the solenoid when triggered, wish I'd bought my meter home from work this weekend!

Power coming out = bad motor.
Power not coming out = bad solenoid.

Still cursing though as this is a brand new one from JK!

[VWCamperfan]

Yep, generally speaking what you said at the end of your last post is correct... providing you have got a good earth on the engine side to complete the circuit.
Also, bear in mind that No. 7 on the diagram (pinion and clutch bit!) should slide freely along the shaft with a bit of a twist. It is possible that if for some reason this has got stuck and the solenoid can't move it into place on the flywheel to engage, then the contacts may never meet.
Ps. The solenoid has two functions: 1. To engage pinion gear onto the flywheel via mechanical lever (Pre engage). 2. Supply power to motor via switch in solenoid once the gears have meshed.

[Mocki]

Also before you remove it from the van again, run a wire from the battery to the signal connection on the solenoid (the 10mm spade connection) because you could have a ignition switch signal fault, not unknown when disturbing the wiring at the starter motor. Al though you said you cleaned it up , the wire itself is known to corrode and go high resistance, so by passing this with a known feed may eliminate this for you.

[Nicola&Tony]

Handy little diagram that, nice one!

Tony

[Rozzo]

hi deaks
the very first thing you should do is update your profile so that folks know where you are help could literally be just around the corner
the new starter you got,, is it new, or recon or 2nd hand? sounds to me like you've got a dodgy one??
i think i'd be taking it back.
the only other very very slim possibility is that for some reason your engine is locked up which could have been the cause of the wire into the starter melting in the first place. full load to it on a jammed engine would have to melt something. try putting the bus in gear and rocking it to make sure the engine is free to turn.
good luck with it.

[ermie571]

You did replace the bush in the engine at the same time as the state didn't you??!!


Em
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