Best Engine to Meet Euro 4 or 6 Emissions? ULEZ issue

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timthemod
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Best Engine to Meet Euro 4 or 6 Emissions? ULEZ issue

Post by timthemod »

I have a 1987 transporter 2.1 DJ engine, camper converted ifrom a van. I live just inside the North Circular Road in London and come 2021 my van will be charged £12.50 per day as it's not a historic vehicle yet and isn't new enough (2006). I am looking at retro fitting an engine that will meet the euro 4 standard that will enable me to possibly keep my van in the ULEZ zone after the 2021 date.

I'm looking at petrol engines and Golf seems to be popular. Although I know the Subaru is also popular I would imagine the possibility of getting a good used Golf engine is more likely.

What is the cost of doing the conversation and are there any specialist places? This could of course be 'a wild goose chase if the authorities don't accept the fact my engine meets the requirements but the Van is just too old. I don't really want to sell it or wait 8 years to get another one.

Thanks

Tim
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slowcoach
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Re: Best Engine to Meet Euro 4 or 6 Emissions? ULEZ issue

Post by slowcoach »

Man that's a tight spot :-\
===================
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clift_d
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Re: Best Engine to Meet Euro 4 or 6 Emissions? ULEZ issue

Post by clift_d »

We're in the same situation so I've done a little bit of research into this, and unfortunately at the moment it's not promising. There isn't currently a way of getting a conversion done and certified such that you would get you an exemption, and all of the retrofit emission control systems are basically only for coaches or HGVs.

TFL wrote:We are not aware of any independently tested, commercially viable retrofit equipment for specialist vans and campervans, although there is a process in place for equipment suppliers to test and certify equipment.

Maybe that will change over the next couple of years, but at present I'm thinking the best option will probably be to store the van outside the 406 and just avoid central London. Also, there will probably be a honeymoon period of at least a couple of years that will get us closer to the 40 year cutoff.
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dirtos3000
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Re: Best Engine to Meet Euro 4 or 6 Emissions? ULEZ issue

Post by dirtos3000 »

I'm currently in the same situation.

My previous engine (2.1 injection Petrol) caught fire, so now have the opportunity to put in a new one that I would hope met Petrol Euro 4 emissions standards. As far as I can see that applies to any engine manufactured circa 2006 - again, Golfs may be easier to locate from that date compared to Subaru, but if anyone has any recommendations on how to source date specific engines it would be appreciated. Getting it certified is another issue altogether, but it would certainly be a step in the right direction if it was in theory 'ULEZ legal'.

My van does have an LPG conversion, which may stand it in good stead with the ULEZ rulings, but there's no guarantees. This may be an option for other Central London dwelling T25 owners.

There are technologies you can add https://atmos-clear.co.uk/products.html#fitting that pull emissions down to acceptable levels, but again these have yet to be officially recognised by TFL. In some circumstances - eg you have LPG/a new engine and you want to register as such with DVLA (which in turn would feed into the TFL database as to whether or not your vehicle was compliant) you can pay to have an emissions test done to prove it is at acceptable levels.

It's fairly early days yet, so I'm hoping they will take on board vagaries such as t25's etc and allow us to prove they are meeting requirements.

In the meantime, going back to my question above - if anyone has any recommendations on how to source date specific engines it would be appreciated..!

Many thanks

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lloydy
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Re: Best Engine to Meet Euro 4 or 6 Emissions? ULEZ issue

Post by lloydy »

As is mentioned above, just fitting a modern engine will change nothing. Euro ratings are for the car as a whole, not just the engine. so unfortunately thats a no go. Surprised to hear about the filter issue though? as ive seen a case study on a diesel fiat campervan that had a filter fitted.

At the moment it looks like if you live in the ULEZ your screwed
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dirtos3000
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Re: Best Engine to Meet Euro 4 or 6 Emissions? ULEZ issue

Post by dirtos3000 »

Yep, gotcha. I thought maybe I was being a bit naive as to what constitutes a Euro 4 rating on it just being an engine.

When you say you heard a case study, do you mean an actual positive ULEZ related case study whereby they had the emissions tested and approved..?

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lloydy
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Re: Best Engine to Meet Euro 4 or 6 Emissions? ULEZ issue

Post by lloydy »

it wont be ulez as its not a going concern yet but here it is http://content.tfl.gov.uk/case-study-pr ... aravan.pdf" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

and a list of the other case studies
https://tfl.gov.uk/modes/driving/low-em ... his-page-4" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
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dirtos3000
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Re: Best Engine to Meet Euro 4 or 6 Emissions? ULEZ issue

Post by dirtos3000 »

Many thanks, Lloydy. Very useful.

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lloydy
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Re: Best Engine to Meet Euro 4 or 6 Emissions? ULEZ issue

Post by lloydy »

Good luck with it, anything you find update us.
I live in the LEZ so I'm sure it'll roll out to me soon
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937carrera
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Re: Best Engine to Meet Euro 4 or 6 Emissions? ULEZ issue

Post by 937carrera »

Those links and helpful examples only apply to diesel vehicles I think, and wow £2,500-£3,500 for a filter plus an additional annual test requirement.

I think I read that the scheme is worth about £300m to TfL over 5 years, and is expected to deliver £7m of health benefits.

It's getting really tough for people with older cars in London, glad I don't live there. I suspect that a lot of garages for older cars will go to the wall or have to relocate out of the ULEZ zone due to lack of customers
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clift_d
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Best Engine to Meet Euro 4 or 6 Emissions? ULEZ issue

Post by clift_d »

I think those figures are from a paper by a bunch who call themselves the 'Alliance of British Drivers'. My understanding is that they view the cost to motorists as a stealth tax, and so they've over-egged the possible revenue figures, and cherry picked a really low possible health cost benefit figure. At the same time they've ignored all of the reduced mortality projections, health benefits for children, etc, etc.

Irrespective of any arguments about the London ULEZ, it's pretty clear that this is something that we're going to see happening more and more across the UK and Europe.
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dirtos3000
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Re: Best Engine to Meet Euro 4 or 6 Emissions? ULEZ issue

Post by dirtos3000 »

I'm totally on board with lowering emissions, I've got two young kids and air quality definitely needs sorting.

What I want to see TFL do is make it easier for drivers to prove their vehicle meets standards by setting up more official testing centres, rather than this blanket ruling with little recourse to open dialogue.

One thing that is infuriating is exempting Black Cab Drivers from ULEZ. As far as I can see, they aren't even requiring them to retrofit any level of filter to their vehicles. Your average diesel cab is one of the more polluting vehicles on the road and there's loads of them in Central London. This isn't going to help lower particulate levels..!

I can feel a campaign coming on...

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clift_d
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Re: Best Engine to Meet Euro 4 or 6 Emissions? ULEZ issue

Post by clift_d »

There's a 15 year maximum age limit for licensed black cabs, which means pretty much any diesel taxis still on the road are likely to be at least Euro 4, and all new cabs registered from 2018 onwards need to be zero emission capable, so I don't think it's as bad as some sections of the media suggest.
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lloydy
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Re: Best Engine to Meet Euro 4 or 6 Emissions? ULEZ issue

Post by lloydy »

i can see some sense in a yearly test of emissions, a bit like the BAR test in california. if you make the grade then you should get a pass. I'd happily change my exhaust and fit the vw CAT if meant i would be ok.
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lloydy
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Re: Best Engine to Meet Euro 4 or 6 Emissions? ULEZ issue

Post by lloydy »

you can buy this in Germany, gives you hope that the filters sold in the UK should be fine..
http://www.tdi-umbau.com/katalysatoren- ... -t3-2.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
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