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insurance/germany
Posted: 16 Apr 2008, 11:58
by syncron ice
Hi,
My nephew is buying a T25 in Germany. Can he get insurance there to drive it back and what are the requirments?
Many thanks,
Tony
Posted: 16 Apr 2008, 12:20
by Titus A Duxass
I think he will have to register as a resident first.
Please give me a minute and I'll see if I can get confirmation.
insurance Germany
Posted: 16 Apr 2008, 12:26
by dearjohn
I got Insurance with FBD to bring my camper back last August, listed the then owners number plate on insurance. Of course this was changed to an export plate, so didn't match up. When in Germany the officials didn't want to recognise the FBD insurance cert, issued me a 2 week insurance (about €80) instead. This was in the same shop which makes up the numberplate. Cancelled the FBD policy and was refunded the money paid to them.
Nigel in cavan
dearjohn@eircom.net
Posted: 16 Apr 2008, 12:29
by Titus A Duxass
Okay, my insurance agent says that the German (insurance) companies will not have anything to do with it.
Your best bet is to contact the ADAC by phone and speak to someone there, most contacts at the ADAC do speak good English.
If you are buying the van off a private owner and it is presently on the road (ie. taxed & tested, insured). You can ask them to leave the plates on so that you can drive it home. Over here the vehicle is insured and not the driver so it is perfectly legal for someone else to drive your car (as long as they are over 25).
There is a short (5 day) registration system available but again you have to have an insurance cover note (Dopplekarte in German) which you can only get from the insurance companies.
Posted: 16 Apr 2008, 12:39
by Titus A Duxass
Here's more:
Okay the ADAC offer a service for someone who is buying a car and is not a resident of Germany.
It does cost 80 euros for a 15 day card and gives you an internation plate for that time.
The vehicle must be in possession of a valid MoT (HU and AU in German).
There will also be a charge for the number plates themselves (about 50 euro).
You may have to join the ADAC first, but that's no bad thing. I recommend the ADAC Plus Mitglied, it comes at a fair price and you get excellent service.
As I stated earlier contact the ADAC, I don't have a telephone number. There is an ADAC thread that will probably have a contact number in it.
german insurance
Posted: 16 Apr 2008, 14:25
by dearjohn
Oh, and by the way, the cost of the plates include road tax for the same duration as the export plates legal period. A sticker is put in the plate to show you have tax and insurance. Police can easily spot elasped tax and insurance this way.
Nigel
Posted: 16 Apr 2008, 18:23
by peasant
OK this is a copy from an article that I wrote on how to export a motorhome from Germany to Ireland ...the main jist of it still applies to VW vans and the UK (too lazy to type it all up again)
German registrations work differently to Irish ones. The vehicle is always registered in connection with the place of residence of the current owner. If the vehicle is sold (or the owner moves) into a different county (or country), the vehicle has to be re-registered there and the old number plates handed back. In Germany the (two little stamps on) the number plates are also proof of registration, tax and NCT (TUEV). Anybody (private seller or dealer) letting you drive on their plates effectively lets you drive on their insurance.
This will not happen for an export, as people will not be prepared to take the risk.
Therefore you need export plates.
In order to get those, the following criteria have to be met:
-The vehicle needs a current NCT/Tuev cert (watch out for this if buying a motorhome thas has been off the road for a while)
-You need to bring along your passport / send a copy ahead if a dealer does the reg for you.
-You need insurance or rather what they call a "Doppelkarte". This is a statement from an insurance company, declaring that they will insure you, once the vehicle is registered in you name. any German insurance broker will sell this to you. Export insurance has relatively high (annual) premiums and only covers third party, nothing else. As the duration is limited to a few days/weeks (you can choose how long you need it for) the premium is not too expensive.
-you need the vehicle registration certificate or "Fahrzeugbrief". This is an A5 size (when folded) document that states all the particulars of the vehicle as well as all previous owners. It is also proof of ownership, whoever holds the "Fahrzeugbrief" is the legal owner of the vehicle. Make sure you don't get cheated into believing that the "KFZ-Schein" is the proof of ownership ...it isn't. It is a credit card size (when folded) document, basically a copy of the "Fahrzeugbrief" with the current owner's name and address on the front. This has to be handed back on de-registration anyway, whereas the "Fahrzeugbrief" remains with the vehicle until such time as it is registerd in Ireland (Then you get issued with an irish vehicle registration cert and the German one gets send back to Germany)
So, on the day (a weekday during office hours! ) you walk up to the German vehicle reg office, hand over your passport, your "Doppelkarte" , the TUEV cert, the "Fahrzeugbrief" and a fee and you get issued with a export number. That you take (usually across the road) to place that makes number plates, pay for them and then go back to the reg office, where you get handed your "Fahrzeugbrief" and temporary export certificate ...and off you go.
It isn't as complicated as it sounds really ...but if you don't speak the language or have somebody take you by the hand and guide you through the process, it could be a bit daunting.
Also, private sellers don't regularly export their vehicles and might be a bit worried and "difficult" about the proceedings, which to the average private German sound about as daunting as they sound to you right now
Hence my recommendation to buy from a dealer ...they should do this as part of their service and have the export plates on the vehicle, ready to go, if you buy from them.
Costs: all in all, depending on how long you want the insurance for ...about 100 - 200 euro, including all fees and number plates.
When buying from a dealer, cost should be zero
Posted: 17 Apr 2008, 09:53
by syncron ice
Many thanks Peasant.
Tony
Posted: 17 Apr 2008, 11:13
by Titus A Duxass
Syncron Ice - Some of the info from Peasant is out of date.
The key issue is the Doppelkarte, as stated you request this from the German insurance agent and it is an agreement between you and them.
It means that you agree to take insurance out with them and they agree to insure your vehicle.
The insurance companies will not issue this if they know that you are not going to need their insurance and you are not a resident of Germany.
They will not sell you a Doppelkarte. You need to arrange international plates.
You may be able to get a Dealer to arrange one for you, but I would question the legality of this.
If you have a bump on the way home the insurance company is more that likely to tell to take a hike (none residency).
Germany the (two little stamps on) the number plates are also proof of registration, tax and NCT (TUEV).
This bit has changed. Each number plate has two stamps; one stamp is for the County where the vehicle is registered and taxed and the other stamp has the expiry date of one of the two mandatory tests.
On the rear plate you get the County stamp and the TÃœV (MOT) or Hauptuntersuchung (HU).
On the front plate you get the same County stamp and the expiry date of the Abgas-Sonderuntersuchungs (AU).
These dates are also on the papers that go with the tests.
Posted: 17 Apr 2008, 11:57
by syncron ice
Thanx Titus.
Tony
Posted: 17 Apr 2008, 17:42
by peasant
Titus A Duxass wrote:
The key issue is the Doppelkarte, as stated you request this from the German insurance agent and it is an agreement between you and them.
It means that you agree to take insurance out with them and they agree to insure your vehicle.
The insurance companies will not issue this if they know that you are not going to need their insurance and you are not a resident of Germany.
They will not sell you a Doppelkarte. You need to arrange international plates.
Sorry to be pernickety now, but you still need a Doppelkarte ...just a specific "export" one.
Any vehicle insurance will sell you one, resident or not ...you can even get it on the internet.
The reason for the Doppelkarte is that you (or the insurance) don't know the reg number of the export plate until it is assigned to you. So the Doppelkarte is a sort of "provisional" insurance agreement (based on the VIN number). The vehicle reg office checks that that is in order and then assigns your plate and gives you an "official" insurance cert with it that has the plate reg on it.
In most towns you will find an insurance agent conveniently located near the vehicle registration office (and the plate shop). They might be ten Euro dearer than the next guy ...but they're there.
If you're really lucky, you might persuade the seller to give up an hour of their time and accompany you to those places and then it shouldn't be a problem at all.
Best bring cash ... not all ofiices/shops/agents accept credit cards.
Posted: 18 Apr 2008, 07:52
by Al Housman
When I collected my Doka last September I simply went to the nearest registration office(Zulassungsstelle).I first bought my insurance (15 days for 65 Euros)-don't go for the cheaper 5 day one,it won't be valid once out of Germany.I then handed over all vehicle documents(insurance,MOT-TUV-,and both vehicle reg papers ) and paid 35 Euros.They issued me with a ticket to take over the road to get my temporary plates(These are specific to you and have an end date in red on.)Back to the office to collect documents.Done.Really quick and painfree-try doing that over here!!Only thing to watch out is that it's not early closing and that you don't go over lunch time-that could delay things
PM me ifyou need more specific info .
Posted: 18 Apr 2008, 09:57
by syncron ice
Thanks all,
very helpful information.
Tony