Club 80-90 Forums

I have been looking for some time for a 2.1 waterboxer to rebuild (to eventually replace my 1.9) . It doesn't need any ancilliaries as I will use mine inc my carb and lpg set up. The trouble is that you see loads of 1.9 DG's for sale, and lots of 'runs ok' engines for sale. But never any 'needs a rebuild' 2.1 for sale. Any clues as to where to find one and what I would expect to pay?

I paid £200 for a 2.1 DJ from a scrapper. The only things that differ between a 2.1 and a 1.9, if you're using all your existing ancillaries, are the crank, the cam and the pistons. If you buy an engine that's described as 'needing a rebuild', bank on having to replace the cam anyway - there are one or two options for buying new. High compression DJ pistons can't be bought new any more (there are some options for the lower compression MV pistons), nor can the crankshaft as far as I'm aware. But if you were able to source those parts separately*, then a 1.9DG could be a good starting point. The con rods, for instance, are the same I believe, and will actually have had an easier life in a DG, due to the shorter stroke.

*Finding these parts separately is the issue of course, so sourcing a 2.1 in the first place would help.

Thanks CJH, I see that vw heritage has 2.1 MV pistons and liners (although in my experience the liners are usually ok with a hone at around 100,000 miles)

Put a wanted ad on here. I did this a few months ago and bought one (and was offered another), all complete but for the flywheel. Paid £400 i think, havn't stripped it yet, but am pleased so far! W

I stumbled across this article on GoWesty's website, which suggests there may in fact be some small differences between the 1.9 and 2.1 cases. To quote:

GoWesty wrote: These are the differences between the 1.9 engine block and the 2.1 block:

1) Main bearing #1 design: 1.9 is one-piece. 2.1 is three-piece.
2) The 1.9 was not originally fitted with an oil cooler.
3) The 1.9 was not originally fitted with a second oil pressure switch near pulley.
4) Early 1.9s are slightly different on top where the plenum bolts on (pre-85 only).
5) The 1.9 has a slightly smaller inside dimension.

However I suspect that they'e actually referring to the differences between the original WBX case and the 'B' case, and that in Europe VW continued to produce the 1.9 in the 'B' case. Maybe someone with more experience could confirm that that's what they mean. Some discussion here.

If it is, then if you're considering a 1.9 case for your 2.1 build, make sure it's a 'B' spec.

FWIW, suff. B is a better guide than the presence/ascence of a diagonal web across the alternator mounting. Very early suff. B dont have it (got one here)

silverbullet wrote:FWIW, suff. B is a better guide than the presence/ascence of a diagonal web across the alternator mounting. Very early suff. B dont have it (got one here)

The engine I'm working on (DJ serial number 1991) is also missing this diagonal web. I know from the DG that's in my van currently that this is a weak spot, so it's crossed my mind to strengthen this area, perhaps by filling in the space where the diagonal web would be with some metal epoxy. Any thoughts on the benefits or otherwise of doing this?

Is it the case that denotes the *1 bearing type 3 piece or 1 piece ? AS I have heard of people using the 1 piece in lieu of the 3 part so the diameter must be the same? Other than that I have heard that a 1.9 case can be used although a small 1mm shaving is taken off the metal where the head studs mount by go westy to ensure that the rod bolts dont contact? I know the camshaft has different timing but I think it uses the same bearings.

Just wondering what is better to have, the higher or lower compression engine? I would have naturally thought the higher compression the better. No?

The high compression is fine for LPG and the best for power and torque but High compression pistons are difficult to get for a decent price unless you can find someone with a serviceable set. AS these engines are known to be a bit heavy on their rods and other bits with the high compression DJ bits the lower compression MV may be worth a punt unless you need mega extra oomph. I have looked at some 95.5 pistons (low compression) to increase the capacity a little but the jury is out on whether they have the correct compression height or not. If they dont reach the top of the bores then the engine will not run correctly and will be down on power.