Idiots guide to buying a Westy
Posted: 13 May 2014, 20:34
Hi all
I thought there may be people out there keen to read about my experience buying my beloved California Hightop; I did lots of researh before buying but still have plenty of tips from the important lessons I have learned, that you may find useful (or even invaluable!). I am not expert by any stretch, but that may help in giving you an 'idiots' point of view.
I bought my van last May. The first issue was 'rarity'. I was after a Westy, as they have the best potential to appreciate in value and the conversion is excellent. However, due to their scarcity, it seems to be a sellers market. I understand they have become rarer each year as the stock reduces; many vans have been scrapped due to serious rust issues and the lack of viability for full restoration. However, in the lat few years, the tables have turned and it is now viable (in most cases) to restore them.
So my first issue was finding a van. Once I did, it was some distance away, so viewing it was difficult. If you go to see a van that is miles away, be prepared to walk away and write off the time effort and money in seeing it; that is harder than it sounds once you've made the effort. If you're a first time buyer, I strongly suggest viewing at least two comparable vans, so you can make a 'relative assessment'. Don't be tempted to buy the van just because it was a trek to see it...
So moving on to what to look out for. From my experience, rust is the only big issue you need to worry about. The cost of repairing the camping equipment, engine, gearbox etc all pale into insignificance compared to the time and cost of sorting rust. Obviously check everything else and make sure you negotiate a reduction if there are engine/camping/gear box isues etc, but that is all fairly easy to uncover, wheres rust isnt!
From my experience, the T25 is now old enough to be rusty, but not old enough for many models to have been through a full restoration. A full restoration is only just now becoming viable for the T25 (cost circa £15k), so be very careful blowing your budget on a seemingly perfect T25 that hasnt been restored, no mater how good it may look.
So in terms of rust, T25s generally rust from the inside out. A quick respray and you may think the van you're loking at is mint. It seems, unfortunately, that there are plenty of vans out there that have reached the point of needing a restoration, but quite often the owner will decide to cut and run rather than take on the investment in the van. This will usually involve a quick respray and masking of the issues.
A case in point is my van last year, seen below, which looks perfect! However, it is very far from perfect!
The Westy model will usually leak rainwater through the square holes cut in the bodywork to house the fridge vent and hookup; unlss replaced, the rubber seal will perish and water will trickle in behind the fridge and rust the van from the inside out. The issue here is that the rust is behind the fridge, so impossible to access. It will rust the side beams, bodywork and floor from the inside. However, it is possible to detect it, with a careful eye. There is a panel just about the sill; it is a smallish oblong; if the seam is not clearing defined, it' probably been filled to plug the rust coming through from the inside. Also look for rusty sills at the base of the van where the metal jons; this is not rust from outside road spray, it is water running through the floor and leaking out the bottom of the panels.
The other obvious place to look is the seams. The seams were spot welded from the inside and often the end of each panels was not well primed. Seams can be easily filled and sprayed and look fine, but usually the rist will come through wihin 6 months. The only real way to be sure is not to buy a van that has been resprayed recently, or if you do, make sure you budget for seam repairs!
Other comon places for serious rust is the inside of the front pillars; water leaks in through the join in the gutter/roof and runs down the inside of the pillar, again rusting from the inside out and hard to spot! Look out for small rust coloured stains on the pillar seam.
I show below a photo of my van looking gat last year (but rusting from the inside!) and a few of the restoration currently underway. The shots of the resto show the panel under he fridge vent being replaced, whih is the one to look out for!
Hope this has been of use!
I'll put sme pic up of the finished article when I get him back in June. Fortunately for me, I didnt spend much on the van, so I could fund the resto (£15k ish). However, if you pay top dolar (£10k plus) for the van, the resto is unlkely to be viable, so be very careful!
Pics to follow...
I thought there may be people out there keen to read about my experience buying my beloved California Hightop; I did lots of researh before buying but still have plenty of tips from the important lessons I have learned, that you may find useful (or even invaluable!). I am not expert by any stretch, but that may help in giving you an 'idiots' point of view.
I bought my van last May. The first issue was 'rarity'. I was after a Westy, as they have the best potential to appreciate in value and the conversion is excellent. However, due to their scarcity, it seems to be a sellers market. I understand they have become rarer each year as the stock reduces; many vans have been scrapped due to serious rust issues and the lack of viability for full restoration. However, in the lat few years, the tables have turned and it is now viable (in most cases) to restore them.
So my first issue was finding a van. Once I did, it was some distance away, so viewing it was difficult. If you go to see a van that is miles away, be prepared to walk away and write off the time effort and money in seeing it; that is harder than it sounds once you've made the effort. If you're a first time buyer, I strongly suggest viewing at least two comparable vans, so you can make a 'relative assessment'. Don't be tempted to buy the van just because it was a trek to see it...
So moving on to what to look out for. From my experience, rust is the only big issue you need to worry about. The cost of repairing the camping equipment, engine, gearbox etc all pale into insignificance compared to the time and cost of sorting rust. Obviously check everything else and make sure you negotiate a reduction if there are engine/camping/gear box isues etc, but that is all fairly easy to uncover, wheres rust isnt!
From my experience, the T25 is now old enough to be rusty, but not old enough for many models to have been through a full restoration. A full restoration is only just now becoming viable for the T25 (cost circa £15k), so be very careful blowing your budget on a seemingly perfect T25 that hasnt been restored, no mater how good it may look.
So in terms of rust, T25s generally rust from the inside out. A quick respray and you may think the van you're loking at is mint. It seems, unfortunately, that there are plenty of vans out there that have reached the point of needing a restoration, but quite often the owner will decide to cut and run rather than take on the investment in the van. This will usually involve a quick respray and masking of the issues.
A case in point is my van last year, seen below, which looks perfect! However, it is very far from perfect!
The Westy model will usually leak rainwater through the square holes cut in the bodywork to house the fridge vent and hookup; unlss replaced, the rubber seal will perish and water will trickle in behind the fridge and rust the van from the inside out. The issue here is that the rust is behind the fridge, so impossible to access. It will rust the side beams, bodywork and floor from the inside. However, it is possible to detect it, with a careful eye. There is a panel just about the sill; it is a smallish oblong; if the seam is not clearing defined, it' probably been filled to plug the rust coming through from the inside. Also look for rusty sills at the base of the van where the metal jons; this is not rust from outside road spray, it is water running through the floor and leaking out the bottom of the panels.
The other obvious place to look is the seams. The seams were spot welded from the inside and often the end of each panels was not well primed. Seams can be easily filled and sprayed and look fine, but usually the rist will come through wihin 6 months. The only real way to be sure is not to buy a van that has been resprayed recently, or if you do, make sure you budget for seam repairs!
Other comon places for serious rust is the inside of the front pillars; water leaks in through the join in the gutter/roof and runs down the inside of the pillar, again rusting from the inside out and hard to spot! Look out for small rust coloured stains on the pillar seam.
I show below a photo of my van looking gat last year (but rusting from the inside!) and a few of the restoration currently underway. The shots of the resto show the panel under he fridge vent being replaced, whih is the one to look out for!
Hope this has been of use!
I'll put sme pic up of the finished article when I get him back in June. Fortunately for me, I didnt spend much on the van, so I could fund the resto (£15k ish). However, if you pay top dolar (£10k plus) for the van, the resto is unlkely to be viable, so be very careful!
Pics to follow...