Club 80-90 Forums

Advice needed please
When I bought Helga she had an Audi TD AAZ engine which has thrown all the coolant and seized. Half the people I have spoken too say running a syncro with an AAZ is too much bus for the engine. Some say upgrade to a VW Passat as it is better suited. Which one tho ? I have been offered a Golf TDI engine but will this not be under the same strain as the AAZ ?
AAAAAAAGGGGGHHHHHHH !!!!!! Too many choices..............

Neil

passats and golfs have the same engines. find out the engine code from the Golf, most likely a 1Z or AHU both miles better than the AAZ.

Thanks Lloydy. There is one for sale on the 80-90 https://club8090.co.uk/forum/viewtopic.php?f=17&t=113184" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Would that be the right type ??

Should be fine, 90bhp. That engine should be transverse I think? So the JX mounts will be able to be used

I had one friend say I should go for the 130bhp ? Same speed less revs being the theory I suppose ?

130bp? Presume he's thinking a pd engine? Possible but very hard/expensive to fit. Engine has to go upright, so engine lid needs raising
A 1Z could be chipped up to that if you wanted. Or go for a AFN (110bhp standard) lots of info on here, inc my getting there thread

just remember that as you push the engine power up you also have to follow suit with the gearbox or you´ll be looking for a new one very soon, when you decide about which engine to go for give Aidan a ring and get some advice

sausage fingers wrote:I had one friend say I should go for the 130bhp ? Same speed less revs being the theory I suppose ?

Horsepower makes no difference to engine speed/revs. Its all about gearing, my friend.

sausage fingers wrote:When I bought Helga she had an Audi TD AAZ engine which has thrown all the coolant and seized.

Any engine will seize without coolant. It will be caused by some other failure first, eg head gasket gone, burst hose, previous damage from abuse in donor car, all sorts of possible reasons for the failure, but it's not because it's an AAZ.

sausage fingers wrote: Half the people I have spoken too say running a syncro with an AAZ is too much bus for the engine.

Sorry to be blunt, but this is nonsense.
Many Syncros left the factory with a smaller diesel engine (1.6TD JX) than you have, and the AAZ has been the most popular upgrade route for years. The AAZ is a good strong engine, and there are many of them out there happily pushing Syncros uphill for many 1000s of miles without trouble. I had an AAZ in my Syncro which was equally happy mud wading and hill climbing in Wales/Scotland or cruising down to Bavaria on the Autobahns at 4000rpm for hours. Never had any engine problems and was still running brilliantly when I reluctantly sold it. Have done several AAZ conversions myself for customers - none have reported any subsequent problems.

My advice would be to replace like for like with a good AAZ (that can ideally be seen running in the donor car first). Perhaps you could buy a Golf/Passat/Seat/Audi80 with one in for a few hundred pounds and run around in it for a week or two before pulling it out to put in the van (but maybe not possible for you if your van's needed back on the road in a hurry).

A word of caution if considering the Tdi upgrade. They may be more powerful, but it is a more complicated conversion so will cost a lot more to do in labour and parts, must be done well or may be less reliable, and if the syncro is too much bus for the AAZ then the Tdi may well be too much engine for the Syncro box without an Aiden rebuild with taller gearing (as mentioned above).

ajsimmo wrote: if the syncro is too much bus for the AAZ then the Tdi may well be too much engine for the Syncro box without an Aiden rebuild with taller gearing (as mentioned above).

Sorry to be blunt but this is nonsense

I am only an enthusiast and not a professional and although I have had an AAZ (or called a ticking time bomb by a friend of mine ) I now have a 110 bhp AFN TDI running a AHF standard (apart from oiling plates) gearbox with standard gears. I talk with people all the time who have had standard gearing and have gone for the longer gears and they wished they hadn't. A standard geared 1.6 td AHF gearbox is more than adequate without the taller gears to push along a van, cruz at 65+mph, get good MPG, power up hills and over take trucks safely without even having to change down out of 4th gear because of the higher revs.

I have spoke with quite a few people with longer gears that can cruz 70+ with the longer gears but the wind resistance at that speed is epic due to the shape of the vans and they use loads and loads of fuel, not so good. Hit a mountain pass if you go anywhere outside the UK or on the country lanes of Wales and your longer 3rd and if you ever get there 4th is one big pain in the a!*e and driving the van becomes very stressful by all accounts rather than having the control of leaving the van in the standard 3rd gear and having loads of power at your foot and a smile on your face.

If you only ever drive a Syncro in this country then an AAZ is a good option but if you go TDI you do not need longer gears or a gear box rebuild. I would have been happy for my old AAZ not to blow up at the time (not the engines fault it failed due to me driving it like a dick) but boy am I happy it blew up, If it didn't I wouldn't have the AFN TDI.

Hope this helps,

PS I have 15" wheels with bigger than standard tyres.

Jed

have to agree, i would not have a AAZ again. A TDI is a completely different animal. As for gearing, i have the longest 3rd and 4th put in mine, but i have such a low ratio final drive i'm pretty much similar to jeds cruising speed at 3000rpm. I do get tempted by longer final drive sometimes, but as above i dont want to sacrifice drive-ability for the sake of top speed.
If you can afford it, TDI it.

jed the spread wrote:

ajsimmo wrote: if the syncro is too much bus for the AAZ then the Tdi may well be too much engine for the Syncro box without an Aiden rebuild with taller gearing (as mentioned above).

I have spoke with quite a few people with longer gears that can cruz 70+ with the longer gears but the wind resistance at that speed is epic due to the shape of the vans and they use loads and loads of fuel, not so good. Hit a mountain pass if you go anywhere outside the UK and your longer 3rd is one big pain in the a!*e and driving the van becomes very stressful by all accounts rather than having the control of leaving the van in the standard 3rd gear and having loads of power at your foot and a smile on your face.



Jed

I had major stress when driving the Grimsal Pass. 3rd was too far away from 2nd, or so I thought at the time. I just coudn't get it to pull 3rd below 2k rpm. I have since had a replacement ECU, not remapped or anything. I now have a lot more power lower down. I'm going to try similar passes this summer and I feel much more confident.

Personally I like the longer gears, but certainly wouldn't want them to be any longer. The only thing I would prefer is a shorter G gear. But it's is the standard 4:86 gearing.

Fuel wise the longer gears didn't improve or reduce the MPG for me. But the downside to cruising at a faster speed is the wind noise. Which to be honest is pretty bad at 70mph. This would possibly improve if I removed some of the carp from my luggage area.

TDI is a excellent choice although it can be expensive to do. I have had this engine in for over a year now and I would without doubt go this route again.

As others point out there are always compromises with what ever you choose to do.

What 4th gear do you have Tom...and what size tyres?....I have a 4.86 set up in the pickup and am in the process of deciding which gars I want 3and 4 to be....intend to be on the approved 215,75,15s.

I really do want swap 4th to gain a slight drop in revs to suit the engine and allow 70mph to be relaxed..I'm a mechanic, over revved engines don't sound nice to my ears..but if I can retain the standard 3rd gear happy days (£300+saved)

After seeing v lux ALS 4 gear turn to dust i have lost faith in standard 4 th gears on a tdi....also I'm only running a 1Z but could just as likely be on the motorway for miles as loaded full of logs and up hill and down dale..

Alex,

I'm running 225 70 16's with a .75 4th, I can't remember what 3rd I have. This gives me 70mph at around 3050rpm. Even when fully loaded it will accelerate up any motorway hill.

Thanks Tom....that's a larger tyre than I intend to use...and the revs are almost spot on in my opinion...