Club 80-90 Forums

As it is a poll with 3 options I have picked 1. Poll, not a debate as to what else can be done. Simples

Surely those voting for a 3k rebuild could get it done now if they were really willing to spend that kind of cash

California Dreamin wrote:Trouble is many of the engine parts are now obsolete from Volkswagen so any quality rebuild is faced with the decision to either use inferior 'pattern' parts or better quality 'but used' original parts.
You cannot truly 'rebuild' to the desired 'high standards' because of this scarcity of quality parts issue.

I'm not sure that's true, for a couple of reasons.

Firstly, they seem to manage just fine in the US, where people like TenCent are turning out VERY highly regarded WBXs - http://www.vanistan.com/performance_waterboxers.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; - $4400 plus exchange, to give us a number to think about. That's £2,600 - plus VAT, of course, so £3,100. John's £3k number is not only realistic, but already in production elsewhere. Unfortunately, transport costs make that a bit of a non-option for us. I think he's got something like a 6-9 month waiting list, so the demand certainly exists in the US.

Secondly, if the demand for better quality aftermarket parts exists, it'd be met. Making internal engine components is no different for a WBX to any other engine, and there's plenty of aftermarket suppliers of top quality internals out there. Again, is the quality of current parts so low because the demand is price-led, rather than quality-led?

I cannot understand why demand is so price-led in the VW world. There's so much scene-tax on vehicle values that a small increase in parts cost would easily be stood. Or is it BECAUSE of that scene tax? The market is saturated with owners who don't understand the reality of old vehicle ownership, and suppliers who are only in it for the bottom line?

flyinghitop wrote:Surely those voting for a 3k rebuild could get it done now if they were really willing to spend that kind of cash

Where though ?

Being water cooled lends the T3 to having other engines fitted, thats not an option for most of the other VW classics

The popularity of diesel becuse of MPG and turbo power/ torque as well makes many turn to engine transplants rather than pay £3k on a wbx that only does 20mpg and in the cas of DG's limps up hills

That's, I think, more the reason why there is low demand.

Dazco wrote:As it is a poll with 3 options I have picked 1. Poll, not a debate as to what else can be done. Simples

its a forum and people will debate unless the post is locked, if you don't want to read the debate you don't have to.

I still say why would you change parts that are within spec, just change the bits that are worn out as for the quality of the rebuild surely you put it together correctly taking the required care and it should be a good job and less than £3000? I just wanted an engine with the parts within spec put together properly to last at least 50,000 miles? I'm not sure that using pattern parts a really expensive one would really last any longer?

123-jn wrote:I still say why would you change parts that are within spec, just change the bits that are worn out as for the quality of the rebuild, surely you put it together correctly, taking the required care it should be a good job and less than £3000? I just wanted an engine with the parts within spec put together properly to last at least 50,000 miles?

Just popped in to say I am in general agreement with 123-jn there (option 2 in the poll I guess)
I would be one of the folk looking at that option if/when I need a motor.

It may be noted though that there are those with a valuable van, be it a mint Cali or a high spec Syncro off roader, that would be willing to pay top dollar for what, in terms of "moving parts" is a "new" engine (like the recons VW used to do).

I am embarking on the "re-build it myself" route.
Not sure I can afford the cost, but doing it myself means that I can take as long as I like and so spread the cost.

£3000 in one lump would be nigh on impossible for me to stump up.

But also, I would like to think that being for my van, I will have a lot more 'care' in doing the job right.

I am doing a DF, so even fewer ponies than a DG.
But I do like the sound of a wasserboxer.

The need for an expensive professional rebuild would be best aimed at those who have minimal mechanical knowledge or negligable confidence in this area.

Or someone with sufficient funds but insufficient time or inclination to do the work themselves.


I am just awaiting the comment that "if I can't afford the cost of a rebuild, then maybe I shouldn't have a van - because we all know that you will always be paying out on a 30 yr old van"

A guy sent me a message (can't say who it was from). Apparently, a while ago, he was seriously thinking of offering top notch WBX engines but decided the was not sufficient market for the product. He went on to say "But.. I stand to be corrected.. and if there are 20 people a year that want a proper engine.. it can be done... "


My reply went like this =

I take your point about folks coughing up the money. I suppose it's easy to "say yes" on a poll (or forum/pub debate), but when it comes down to it.... Mind you, there are plenty of BMW / Range Rover / Yankee muscle car / etc owners who willingly pay this sort of money for engines. It's a bit chicken and egg I reckon, if you invested all the time and money into a project like that and found insufficient takers you would be very disappointed I am sure, or you might end up making money and being highly revered.

I just find it frustrating that there is no-one here (unlike America ) offering the service.

Also I don't understand why the likes of Elite don't offer a 2 tier service. They have all the facilities, skills and experience already in place. Sell a basic "repaired" engine as they do now, but also offer a bespoke "to your requirements" engine. Their kudos would increase as well.

This all is "in my head" because once again (twice in 8 years) I have a drippy head seal on an otherwise spot on engine. Whilst I have the knowledge and experience to DIY it, I simply do not have the time or place to do it. Like many others, I would love the opportunity to buy a "new" engine, one I can be pretty sure will last the life of my ownership. (or alternatively, get my drippy seal repaired by an outfit who has a good reputation for success)

Ah, well, better get some work done,
All the best,
John

2.2ltr tuned/improved WBX in the USA @ ~ £2.2K They do a standard 1.9 and a 2.1 for less dosh, but obviously all these motors are only available to USA customers due to shipping.

I did get a communication from a reputable outfit (can't name them here, yet, nor by p.m. by the way) who has indicated that they might be offering something similar here in the UK in the near future I hope I can be first in the queue

ghost123uk wrote:2.2ltr tuned/improved WBX in the USA @ ~ £2.2K They do a standard 1.9 and a 2.1 for less dosh, but obviously all these motors are only available to USA customers due to shipping.

I did get a communication from a reputable outfit (can't name them here, yet, nor by p.m. by the way) who has indicated that they might be offering something similar here in the UK in the near future I hope I can be first in the queue

You can get a 2.2 injection wbx from the engine shop in Erith, Kent - but don't know anyone who has used them or has one:

http://www.theengineshop.info/acatalog/ ... _2200.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Unless I am getting mixed up (and please correct me if I am) they have been on Watchdog and other such programmes

ghost123uk wrote:Unless I am getting mixed up (and please correct me if I am) they have been on Watchdog and other such programmes

Oh blimey, that may be the reason why no one mentions them when there's someone looking for a replacement engine John!

Like I say, I only know what I know from doing a bit of Googling on the subject, as I was this very morning, when I found THIS INFO which is what I based my above comments on.

I will hang on for my recent "correspondent" to get geared up