Cruise control instalation and alternative parts.

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Rascal
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Re: Cruise control relay....?

Post by Rascal »

Nice work Maxstu.   just looked on flebay.     can get nearly the entire system for  around £100 ..... just kleaves making a loom and  a stalk !
 

Forden341
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Re: Cruise control relay....?

Post by Forden341 »

This is the Rangie wiring set up you can see that the switches are just momentary push to make switches and could be mounted anywhere.

Image

Image

The cassette mentioned was just a way of having the 2 switches mounted on the steering wheel but could easily be 2 switches mounted anywhere on the dash or in a switch blank on the binnacle.
It’s quite a simple set up once you have all the bits.
It’s still on my to do list but I have all the bits.

Hope this helps.

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maxstu
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Re: Cruise control relay....?

Post by maxstu »

Certainly does. As Rascal mentions, l need a wiring loom, so those diagrams are very helpfully. Thanks.
One area l can't understand is why the CC system gets wired into rear braking lights?
Surely the vacuum switch linked to brake pedal is adequate? On an Auto BTW.
Watching an install on a GoWesty video no mention of brake wiring whatsoever. Is it compulsory in UK/EURO law? If not then that shortens the loom considerably.
MaxStu
1989 DJ 2.1 Auto Leisuredrive rusty bucket.
"Blissfully happy in your presence".

Forden341
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Re: Cruise control relay....?

Post by Forden341 »

I believe it cuts the ecu electronically as well as interrupting the vacuum too or else once the vacuum is restored it will go full throttle to try and make up the speed again!

Rascal
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Re: Cruise control relay....?

Post by Rascal »

now I know it can be done relatively cheaply done some digging and found this image,,, looks like i can duplicate the loom from it.
now excuse my ignorance but my understanding is that when you set the cruise  control the  vacuum pump simply holds  the  vacuum servo  ( holding the throttle in position) them the ecu silver box thing uses the vss to maintain the speed buy adjusting the vacuum servo appropriately.  and the  clutch and brake sensors (manual transmission)  are literally vents so if pedal is depressed it essential causes a vacuum leak and disengages the system ?
 so  i think the only thing that cant  be  used as a direct swap is the stalk control and  and the servo mounting bracket  ( pedal brackets are available from brickwerks)
Image

Forden341
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Re: Cruise control relay....?

Post by Forden341 »

My limited understanding is that when you hit the set button at the desired speed the ECU will count the pulses from the VSS and then activate the vacuum pump to suck the bellows and hold the throttle at that speed, if the vehicle goes over or under and the pulse count changes then it will increase or reduce vacuum to adjust the throttle. You can also add speed I believe by the buttons. The brake and clutch switches interrupt and dump all the vacuum and also electrically shuts things down until the set button is pushed again.

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maxstu
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Re: Cruise control relay....?

Post by maxstu »

Good info chaps...

Connection rod at vancafe, if needed? But l think it fits only on fuel injection throttle. Not sure.

https://www.vancafe.com/025130365-p/025130365.htm
MaxStu
1989 DJ 2.1 Auto Leisuredrive rusty bucket.
"Blissfully happy in your presence".

Rascal
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Re: Cruise control relay....?

Post by Rascal »

https://youtu.be/KcIL_K9H8zQ

Found this interesting I can't find any reference to it being fitted to diesels only WB

But I see no reason why not and I will simply fabricate a bracket to mount the vacuum actuator.. I'd recommend using the rod, as you can see in the video it's a sliding connection.. And allows the throttle to be controlled without fighting against the diaphram of the actuator.
It lso appears some jags used the same system.. XJ40 Being one

Forden341
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Re: Cruise control relay....?

Post by Forden341 »

That video is great, I’ve dug out my Range Rover box of bits and taken a couple of pics for reference.

ImageImageImageImageImage

They look identical to the pictures earlier in the post, hopefully the part numbers will be helpful.

Rascal
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Re: Cruise control relay....?

Post by Rascal »

So earlier today I took a punt on a range rover actuator and vacuum pump for £25.. Two pedal vacuums switches from (lithunasia) £20 delivered the pair.. Now really all I'm after is the dash loom putting off having to make it.. The control unit range rover one is £20 on ebay never going to find a stalk but all it is is an on off switch... And a momentary trigger to set..
So I intend to to mount a simple on off switch somewhere.. And I recall my MK 1 escort having a floor mounted windscreen washer switch.. I like the idea of mounting Somthing similar to it discreetly out the way..

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maxstu
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Re: Cruise control relay....?

Post by maxstu »

Brilliant video and much thanks. That is a Godsend. This is getting very interesting. We need to start a cruise control support group. :lol:

Im not familiar with the diesel throttle to carb/injection set up. I guess it depends on which diesel you have? However, if its a cam type cable operated system, then mount the vacuum actuator forward of original cam and use another cam mounted to the first with a customised short cable (or bar) to actuator and cruise control system.

Fortunately (perhaps) l have a DJ 2.1 and mostly the internet info shows that engine. I looked at engine today and can see the throttle has the ball mounting for the CC bar. But uncertain exactly where to mount actuator. Im testing a 1997 XJ40 actuator shortly. I guess in a place of least resistance?

Im willing to buy the clutch or brake plate from Brickwerks. For the list price its worth it. I see another plate sits over brake lever. That easy to make.

The brake vacuum switch lve yet to buy. So eBay link please. Otherwise B5 Passat or T4 looks the same. But a bit more money.

Two concerns for me. Firstly wiring loom. Im useless at this kind of think. So any help from you guys would be fantastic.
And controls at steering column. I reckon l will get an early Subaru set. There is an on/off switch. Then the actual settings control mounted on right side of steering column. Most other stalks are left side mounted. Oh for a cheap remake of the genuine stalk to save problems. On the lookout though. :ok

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Subaru-Fores ... SwB-1Y3m~v

Yet am happy to be directed towards an easier set up.
MaxStu
1989 DJ 2.1 Auto Leisuredrive rusty bucket.
"Blissfully happy in your presence".

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maxstu
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Re: Cruise control relay....?

Post by maxstu »

Forden341 wrote: 08 Dec 2020, 19:19 :ok That video is great, I’ve dug out my Range Rover box of bits and taken a couple of pics for reference.

ImageImageImageImageImage

They look identical to the pictures earlier in the post, hopefully the part numbers will be helpful.
I think you are in luck with the pump for sure. My original VW vacuum pump has the numbers 003 572 imprinted on it too. It looks identical:ok
 
MaxStu
1989 DJ 2.1 Auto Leisuredrive rusty bucket.
"Blissfully happy in your presence".

Rascal
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Re: Cruise control relay....?

Post by Rascal »

so the part number for the switches is 811 907 343 B
 i just put it into ebay an bought second hand ones 
the issue im having at the moment is finding the  strange looking captive nuts for them 
431 721 283 B  brickwerks are out of stock..  i can only find them in the USA
as you say there is a plate that goes onto the pedal arm, easy to fabricate. 

Club Joker
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Re: Cruise control relay....?

Post by Club Joker »

Hi,

I've been investigating this myself. I bought most of a T25 cruise control system a few years ago. This included the stalk, harness and control unit, but no pedal switches or pump / diaphragm unit.

The pedal switches are quite easy to find on ebay.  Switch mounts available from Brickwerks, and you can also use their vacuum hose.  The Bently manual has a great diagram, and you can also find the part numbers and diagrams online.  You can also find generic Y hose parts quite easily.

Difficult bits to find are are:

- the funny nuts that secure the switches to the mounts.  They are never in stock anywhere!  BUT, the thread on the switches is (or is very close to) an M12 x 1.0 fine pitch.  You can use a pair of these on each switch.  That's what mine are fixed with and they work fine.
- The brackets that go on the pedals to activate the switches. I made some and will post some photos.
- Pump and diaphragm unit. I came to the same conclusion as you have that a Range Rover Unit was the way to go.  The P38 units are readily available and quite self contained.  You can always separate the pump from the diaphragm to make mounting easier.  Mine is an AGG engine, so I had to fabricate a little mounting bracket near the accelerator.  I'll take some pictures tomorrow.

I have fitted everything to my van, but it's not working yet!  :roll: I have a homemade speed sensor on mine, so I am not 100% sure that I have connected it up right.  It's also connected to the AGG ECU which may be complicating things.  Also not convinced that I have connected the wires correctly at the pump end.  I think that the problem is one of these two things.  Either that or my control box or stalk are not working properly.  I need to go through the procedures in Bentley and see where I get to.

I'll take some pictures of my set up tomorrow, so you can see the physical side of it all.

Ben

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maxstu
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Re: Cruise control relay....?

Post by maxstu »

Cheers Rascal. Where are you getting all the part numbers from?
Last night l spent ages searching for an appropriate vacuum switch! Mainly by cross checking images. Thanks to you l now know buying a Passat B5 switch is correct. Being auto l only needed one. £15.00 delivered. I was going to wait until its in my hand then source a couple of locking nuts. Plastic or metal. Then Mr Club Joker comes along and save the day.

So thanks to both. :ok

Image
MaxStu
1989 DJ 2.1 Auto Leisuredrive rusty bucket.
"Blissfully happy in your presence".

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