I recently drained the coolant on Betty and did so by detaching the feed and return pipes at the front of the van. They were secured with very rusty jubilee clips so I’d thought I’d be clever and replace them with nice shiny stainless steel ones. One of the guys at Elite noticed them and warned me that jubilee clips have a tendency to pinch/split the hoses as they don’t allow for expansion etc. He said to change them before it ends in tears (not so clever after all ). He also mentioned something about metal inserts in the pipes but I didn’t follow him on that one so if anyone can enlighten me I’d be interested to know what the significance is.
So I’m after some advice on replacing the jubilee clips to avoid any future problems. I’ve scanned the forum and as far as I can gather spring clips could be the way to go? Someone (Ian I think) suggested Mikalor spring clips but the largest ones I could find were 20mm and I think the feed and return pipes are 40mm.
The Mikalor clips go from 17-252mm! You can still get the original spring clips from a VW van centre. I've not heard the expansion cooling leading to cracked pipes before but I guess it makes sense esp with the metal insert expanding at a different rate to the hard plastic.
heres a temp fix I did on the coolant pipes one one of mine, you can see the ends of the coolant pipe have a mteal insert https://club8090.co.uk/wiki/Co ... pipe_leaks" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
It's got me now worried now though the hoses might blow off the plastic front to rear pipes if get stuck in traffic. I can't recall there being any metal inserts although I wasn't paying particular attention as I didn't know about them.
I was hoping just to replace the jubilee clips but looks like I'm gonna have to drain it again and check it out. Not a job I look forward to
the plastic coolijg pipes are not that hard/tough as have reinfocred ends with a thinnish metal insert pipe which is fitted inside th end of the platic by an inch or two. These inserts are mild stel i think so can eventually rust but plenty of folk on here will sell you a good one with decent unprersihed ends just in case. I know a while ago Billy 739 (think thats his name) na trader on here had some decent ones and hes generaly very relaible and decent.
I would not believe other people's hoprro tories or provocations otwards anxiety, if its going to fail at some pint it will but don't think this is likely or going to happen soon just becasue someone scares you with stories of woe. From experience however most reasons for premature failure of anything on these old vans if due to ack of routine and nregaulr maintenance. I.e. if you check the various old parts fitted and kep them up to a good atndard then it will run forever- its just simple sense that if you have a worn out old car it will not run foreever without careful upkeep but dopn;t expect it to come cheap or just keep running. In fact even after spending money keepoijg it going over the eyars I think it ust sgtill work out a lot chaper and environmentally better that either buying a new car or watching your investment in any vagualy new vehicle go down the drasin with depreciation! Li' ol' boxing day rant there, not really aimed at anyone at all. Good luck with your pipes! Tim
NB I use stainless steel motorbike hose clamps from ebay for everything, strong and wide without any sharp edge.
ISTR, that the there are the two types of jubilee clips. There are those that have cut out serrations for the screw guide and those that have pressed serrations. There was an article I read a while back (can't find it now...typical) that said the clips with the cut out serrations can....I stress can, have a detrimental effect on the hose, squeezing the rubber through the serrations and so start the separation of inner from outer, whereas the pressed serration type do not let this happen.
Yes Mikalor clamps are much better than jubilee type, but equally much more expensive. I have been using the pressed jubilee type all my mechanic-ing life and have not yet come across any separation of hoses.
We also use them offshore for lots of applications including lifeboat motor hoses and these have to be good for the safety of life at sea.
oh gawd - I'd be asking the mechanic who told him that story! Ive never heard of this happening to anything
Spend a mo and have a think about just how many millions and millions of jubilee clips are on engines - and the fact there was a a rusty one on your van which hadn't caused any issues, kinda answers itself really
It is by will alone that I set my 'van' in motion!
I quite , HIC, agree, HIC and all who use you fine vessel sir!
Aren't vans more satisfying than Xmas? When working or not- both have a different attraction.
Dito...nothing wrong with good quality jubilee clips..
I must admit that they are not the best for small fuel pipe sizes but in my experience there are no issues when then are used with larger pipe sizes.
Any problems that do occur are normally associated with the use of oversized clips that distort in shape when tightened down to a smaller size...tightening down a larger clip creates an eliptical clamping shape and uneven tightness around the hose.
If the correct size is used they retain correct shape and even clamping force around the hose.
California Dreamin wrote: Any problems that do occur are normally associated with the use of oversized clips that distort in shape when tightened down to a smaller size...tightening down a larger clip creates an eliptical clamping shape and uneven tightness around the hose.
If the correct size is used they retain correct shape and even clamping force around the hose.
Martin
You're no-doubt right Martin, however our applications at work tend to call for a tighter fastener and the extra width ( ) I've always found works extemely well on automotive hoses ... they may not be cheap but they certainly don't leak. And as with a Jubilee clip if you use the hexagon to tighten it you get a good 'feel' for how tight it is.
Ian
The Hulley's Bus 1989 2.1DJ Trampspotter LPG courtesy of Steve @ Gasure
I understand where you are coming from regarding the jubilee clips. The ones that were on my van were old enough to be completley rotten and there was no sign of a leak so they were obviously doing the job ok. Since I replaced them with new jubilee clips though, following the system drain, there seems to be a slight leak. Maybe the plastic pipes have cracked? Or the hoses aren't seated as well as they were before? I found it really difficult to get them off even once the clips were removed when draining. And I'm not sure they've gone on as far as they were either. I had considered heating the rubber pipes to make them more maleable but I didn't fancy doing that so near the petrol tank. I'm hoping the broader Mikalor clips will create a better seal. What do you think?
Does anyone know what size Mikalor Clips you need for the front to rear hoses. I stupidly order 38mm ones forgetting to consider the rubber hoses - doh! Without taking the hose off looks like 44mm would do. Is that about right?
dugcati wrote:oh gawd - I'd be asking the mechanic who told him that story! Ive never heard of this happening to anything
Spend a mo and have a think about just how many millions and millions of jubilee clips are on engines - and the fact there was a a rusty one on your van which hadn't caused any issues, kinda answers itself really
Can`t say i`ve heard such a jackonary about jubilees either. 25 years on van pipes still look original. Something stinks.
The issue normally comes when you try to undo it, as I said above IF you use the hexagon on the the worm-drive to tighten/slacken the clips you get a much better purchase on it .... also prevents screwdriver through the hose syndrome or having to cut the clip off.
Here's the 'Jubilee' tool ..
Ian
The Hulley's Bus 1989 2.1DJ Trampspotter LPG courtesy of Steve @ Gasure
). He also mentioned something about metal inserts in the pipes but I didn’t follow him on that one so if anyone can enlighten me I’d be interested to know what the significance is.
