Brake Fail !!!

[Birty]

Can anyone help ? The brakes on my devon camper have just failed, they were fine 2 days ago, but when i went to use it today i found the brake pedel was traveling to the floor, pumping the brakes does no good, there is fluid in the system & when the engine is off the brake pedel hardens back up, then with engine runing pedel goes to the floor again !! could this be a master cylinder problem ? there doesent seem to be any sign of leakage on the wheels that i can see. Any ideas.... fanx, sim.

[fairwynds]

Engine type?
Ive had a similar issue in past, and was traced to the brake vacuum hose in the engine bay, with a hole right through it! Beare, they are made of steel wire reinforced pipe, and the wires have a habit of cutting you when you grab em!

[kevtherev]

probably the master cylinder, nice simple job, and all the parts are available

[California Dreamin]

Engine type?
Ive had a similar issue in past, and was traced to the brake vacuum hose in the engine bay, with a hole right through it! Beare, they are made of steel wire reinforced pipe, and the wires have a habit of cutting you when you grab em!

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^Not if the pedal goes to the floor^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

As Kev says...more likely the master cylinder has failed although it might be worth bleeding the brakes just to be sure.

Martin

[hippy chick]

My last camper did this, not funny when your coming up to a roundabout the peddle went flat to the floor but it did come back with some pumping . mine turned out to be master cylinder. jen

[Titus A Duxass]

Mine did this some years ago - also the Master Cylinder.

[lamb125]

The problem I've recently experienced is a hot smell from the front off-side brake calliper...binding. Upon inspection the pads are low, and look ready for changing. The callipers are Girling, is changing the pads a straight fwd job? Also, my theory for the binding is the piston travel, i.e. its reached the end of it travel (on a worn pad) and isnt retracting smoothly. When practicing an emergency stop the van pulls up nicely, pretty well in fact.

[California Dreamin]

The problem I've recently experienced is a hot smell from the front off-side brake calliper...binding. Upon inspection the pads are low, and look ready for changing. The callipers are Girling, is changing the pads a straight fwd job? Also, my theory for the binding is the piston travel, i.e. its reached the end of it travel (on a worn pad) and isnt retracting smoothly. When practicing an emergency stop the van pulls up nicely, pretty well in fact.

Binding and hot on one side indicates a seizing caliper. Pistons don't reach the end of their travel, they just keep going and would pop out if the pads weren't fitted.
Chances are the piston dust seal is split and salt water/crap has corroded the exposed piston. This will need a very careful examination if you intend to re-use the caliper, you maybe able to free it off by working it back and forth but if in doubt fit an exchange refurb caliper.
Check disc thickness against spec
Make sure everything moves freely

Martin

[lamb125]

Thanks for the advice Martin. Must admit the binding has been intermitent, but I'll will give the calliper, etc a good look over before taking any chances.

Thanks again...will get back to you

[AdrianC]

Hold on one mo before buying a master cylinder. The pedal's hard with the engine off, you said? If so, that definitely sounds servo-related to me. If the master was bad, it'd sink all the time.

[Birty]

Thanx you lot,, gonna bkleed the brakes 1st. fingers crossed that sall it is ?/

[lamb125]

Thanks for the advice Martin. Must admit the binding has been intermitent, but I'll will give the calliper, etc a good look over before taking any chances.

Thanks again...will get back to you

Strangley the o/s pads were worn right down (to approx 2mm thick), but the n/s pads like new?!? No sign of any leaks from the piston seals either. Whilst waiting for new pads to arrive Ive temporarily put a decent pad and more worn pad in each side to balance both sides up - seems ok...not ideal of course

[AdrianC]

Strangley the o/s pads were worn right down (to approx 2mm thick), but the n/s pads like new?!?

Only two reasons for that...

1. The last person who was in there is a bodgemonkey of the worst order, and put new pads in one side only.
2. The NS caliper's sticking.

Driving in a straight line, loosen your grip on the steering wheel - but be ready to catch it. Brake hard. Does the van pull? If not, then the first is the likely one...

[CycloneMike]

Just as likely the OS is sticking. It applies but does not return, therefore causing you over heating and worn pads. Change caliper and flexible hoses, then have peace of mind. exchange calipers are about £50 each and hoses about a tenner.

[ghost123uk]

Thanx you lot,, gonna bkleed the brakes 1st. fingers crossed that sall it is ?/

Take care here, if your master is shot and allowing air into the system, and then you bleed that air out, all might seem ok for a while but IF it is a duff master you could end up with no brakes when approaching a T junction at 40 MPH

If there looks to be the correct amount of fluid in the tank then it is VERY unlikely to be air in the system without a good reason ( like your van has spent some time on it's side or upside down )

I would change the master cylinder as a precaution as it is not an expensive or big job.
If that does not fix it then, as mentioned above, it is likely the Servo. A bit dearer but your life (and others) is at stake !