Damaged Valve Stems – Are Lash Caps a solution?

[airheadboxer]

I have just found I have a problem with damaged valve stem ends 

I can’t get a decent picture of mine at the moment, so here is a picture from another posting (if anyone objects to my using this pic I am happy to remove it):

 
In the same post the question was asked “…… there are caps you can get to go over the end, would this work?” 
And a link pointed to this item: https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/BEETLE-Valve ... 2001512483"

 Just in case the eBay link disappears in future the item description for reference is/was “BEETLE Valve lash caps, hardened, set of 8, for 8mm stem” and the supplier in this case is VW Heritage.
 
VWH’s eBay item description identifies them as:
 
“Hardened inlet/exhaust valve lash caps. These are for 8mm valve stems and supplied in a set of 8 to do all valves on one engine. [Luckily mine are all 8mm valve stems. It’s a DG engine] 

Lash caps are designed to protect the valve stem in high performance engines when no swivel feet are used. 
To fit 8mm stem valve. Adds approximately 0.060 inches to the valve lift height“

 0.06 Inches = 1.524 Millimeters apparently, although wouldn’t this be adjusted out using the tappet screw to leave the geometry unaffected? Of course it depends on how deep they are in relation to the collets and the stem end.

 I’m not suggesting they might be a permanent solution; I just need to do something to get me through the summer.

 I didn’t see any response to the question, so does anyone have any experience of this method please? Does anyone actually have any caps spare (new or good used ones) I could have for a consideration to try out?
 
Thanks.

[davidoft1]

They can be a solution, those are quite bad , how bad are your ones ?

[airheadboxer]

They can be a solution, those are quite bad , how bad are your ones ?

Thanks for the reply and the assessment. It is encouraging that the lash caps are a possibility (under what circumstances do you think?), but your assessment of the pictures on the original posting isn't so encouraging 

I've been out and had another go at getting pictures and these are the results (I've only checked one side so far and of the 4 valves only these 2 are of concern, they are the inlet valves):

This one has a shallow even indentation with a thin rim round the edge:



This one on the otherhand is a little more challenged:



In my defence, I've not had the van long and done very few miles. The PO said he'd had the valves adjusted just prior to me buying it so this must have been evident then.

Thoughts?




 

[davidoft1]

They can be a solution, those are quite bad , how bad are your ones ?

Thanks for the reply and the assessment. It is encouraging that the lash caps are a possibility (under what circumstances do you think?), but your assessment of the pictures on the original posting isn't so encouraging 

I've been out and had another go at getting pictures and these are the results (I've only checked one side so far and of the 4 valves only these 2 are of concern, they are the inlet valves):

This one has a shallow even indentation with a thin rim round the edge:



This one on the otherhand is a little more challenged:



In my defence, I've not had the van long and done very few miles. The PO said he'd had the valves adjusted just prior to me buying it so this must have been evident then.

Thoughts?




 

That’s toast unfortunately, is it air cooled or water ?

[airheadboxer]

That’s toast unfortunately, is it air cooled or water ?

It's a DG engine so water.

It wasn't until I saw the close-up picture of the second valve did I realise how bad it was. Sounds like its too late for my engine.   

I know it is a personal judgement call, and it is up to people to make their own assessment of any risks involved, but when could the lash caps be considered do you think?  For example, in comparison the picture I linked originally  (see below - not my valve [mine is worse] or my picture ) the damage doesn't seem so extensive. Would I be a bad person to consider the caps in that case?

Sorry if it seems I'm labouring the question, but the caps look an interesting work around to the problem in some circumstances - its what people think those circumstances are in practical terms.

[davidoft1]

i would have probably given them a go on the first picture, but the picture of your damaged one is very bad, the issue isnt the damage in itself its the damage that could be caused, i would say the top of the valve could break off and drop the valve into he engine on yours, i expect youve had a collapsed cam follower, if you can get the heads off, no head studs snap etc its perfectly repairable

[Syncronorth]

I don't know anything about lash caps so, but it won't take that long to remove the heads and change the valves. Valves is about a 10£ each or you can get used ones, a complete gasket set 100£ so it won't cost you that much if you do it yourself. Wouldn't be surprised if you need new water gaskets anyway.

Do you have a picture of your tappet adjustment screw? I'm just curious how it looks like.

[Oldiebut goodie]

i would have probably given them a go on the first picture, but the picture of your damaged one is very bad, the issue isnt the damage in itself its the damage that could be caused, i would say the top of the valve could break off and drop the valve into he engine on yours, i expect youve had a collapsed cam follower, if you can get the heads off, no head studs snap etc its perfectly repairable

WHS^^^^

I would expect that area to have had quite a hammering and consequently the metal structure to have altered with the risk of the end coming off.

[TONYT25T25]

Just out of curiosity what led you to investigate.  I am wondering if this is a common problem and should be checked as a matter of course, are there any symptoms that give a hint to this problem.

[airheadboxer]

i would have probably given them a go on the first picture, but the picture of your damaged one is very bad, the issue isnt the damage in itself its the damage that could be caused, i would say the top of the valve could break off and drop the valve into he engine on yours, i expect youve had a collapsed cam follower, if you can get the heads off, no head studs snap etc its perfectly repairable

WHS^^^^

I would expect that area to have had quite a hammering and consequently the metal structure to have altered with the risk of the end coming off.

Thanks fellas, got to agree about the risks caused by the damage.

I don't know anything about lash caps so, but it won't take that long to remove the heads and change the valves. Valves is about a 10£ each or you can get used ones, a complete gasket set 100£ so it won't cost you that much if you do it yourself. Wouldn't be surprised if you need new water gaskets anyway.

Do you have a picture of your tappet adjustment screw? I'm just curious how it looks like.

Tappet pictures follow:

For reference, this one looks OK. And it also looks suspiciously newish to me:
 


 These relate to the earlier stem picture showing a shallow indentation and a lip round the edge:

 
These relate to the earlier stem picture where it looks like a hole is being bored down the centre. The main difference is that there are fewer threads visible above the locknut (now I've seen it this one stands out just by looking at each of the tappet screws on the shaft and an obvious sign something is not right) and more threads at the stem end. Also the unthreaded part at the stem end is shorter/worn away.


 

Just out of curiosity what led you to investigate.  I am wondering if this is a common problem and should be checked as a matter of course, are there any symptoms that give a hint to this problem.

I was in there checking the valve adjustment for two reasons, the first was that I am aware of the possible issues around the valves needing adjustments after high mileages and the consequences of them being wrong, so would have done it anyway having not long got the van.

The second reason is specific to this van – the previous owner told me his mechanic had adjusted the valves before I bought the van. This worried me for two reasons: one is that his mechanic had to phone somebody to find out how to do it and secondly I wasn’t convinced this mechanic wasn’t responsible for me needing a new crank pulley, crankshaft oil seal, crankshaft oil thrower and a new metal water pipe that runs behind the pulley because they hadn’t tightened the crank pulley fully causing it to wobble and chew things up (there were new nuts and bolts in the area so somebody had been working in the vicinity recently).
I’m now going off to save up some money and then find somebody in Buckinghamshire or Oxfordshire or north of London who is familiar with these engines to see what this is going to cost me.

On a more positive note, at least this has floated the possibility of using lash caps (for some reason each time I see that term it brings a smile to my face) if your valve stems are 8mm and not badly damaged (unlike one of mine).

Thanks to everyone for their replies and comments, I appreciate you taking the time.