New engine running too rich

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Mooney
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New engine running too rich

Post by Mooney »

Hi,

So i've recently put in a reconed engine 1.9 DG and reconnected all the ancillaries.

It's got a relatively new Brosol version of the Pierburg 2E3 carb, the timing has been set properly according to Itchy's guide viewtopic.php?p=8240201

The mixture on the carb is 1 1/2 turns out from being all the way in, has had new breather pipes, vac pipes, dizzy advance works, new air filter, fuels being delivered correctly, new spark plugs, rotor arm etc. 

However when i go to start it, it runs great for about 10 seconds before slowly sputtering and eventually cutting out. When i take the spark plugs out, they're dry, carbon fouled. This pic was after they've been running for about 10 seconds had wire brushed them clean just before.

Image

I've had no issues with the carb before. Batteries are fully charged at 100%, am i maybe not getting enough air or a weak spark? I've tried running it with the pancake off and still won't idle long enough for the choke to come off. 

For some reason i managed to get it to run the other day, the engine warmed, choke came off and it all ran smoothly and then when i tried again yesterday and today it fouls the plugs within seconds. I'd suspect the ignition system except it's got a year old bosch coil that ran fine on the old engine, newish HT leads from brickwerks <7,000 miles on them, brake vacuum hose from brickwerks too, newish ignition module. 

Any advice appreciated as i'm slowly tearing my hair out
1983 1.9 DG WBX Automatic

Mooney
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Re: New engine running too rich

Post by Mooney »

Ok so just tested the king lead against cylinder head about a 4mm gap and getting a orange spark. Is this too weak?

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1983 1.9 DG WBX Automatic

Mooney
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Re: New engine running too rich

Post by Mooney »

1983 1.9 DG WBX Automatic

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sarran1955
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Re: New engine running too rich

Post by sarran1955 »

Hello,

If it fires and runs on the same ignition set up as before...
...and you have had no issues with the Brosol...
...and a good spark..

Try 2 1/2 turns on the idle screw...

and check that the fuel is flowing properly..

You will be able to get it running, albeit a bit rough, and then redo the dynamic timing with the strobe gun...

I know this is frustrating, but you will get there...

Cordialement,

:ok
Help and advice on Aircooled engines here:
http://www.youtube.com/user/sarran1955/videos?view=0" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Mooney
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Re: New engine running too rich

Post by Mooney »

Thanks but i'm not sure if i am getting a good spark. It's orange and shouldn't it be blue/white? I've tested it again at the spark plug, and attached the video. 



Fuel is flowing properly, idle speed screw is good, i don't want to richen the mixture anymore as the plugs are sooty already.
1983 1.9 DG WBX Automatic

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DoubleOSeven
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New engine running too rich

Post by DoubleOSeven »

I think it’s too lean too, the spark plugs are only black because it’s essential running on choke at the moment. Needs a good run. My idle mix is 3 1/2 turns out. I would swap the coil for another one just to check if you’re convinced it’s poor spark though.

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1984 Caravelle 2.1 MV

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Cobra88
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Re: New engine running too rich

Post by Cobra88 »

yep my 2E3 idle mixture is approx 3 & a half turns out too.
my CO is approx 2.0-2.2 %

Rick
Image
Last edited by Cobra88 on 15 Jul 2020, 17:28, edited 1 time in total.
____________________________________________
84 CaravelleGL 1.9 DG WBX Bronze Beige Metallic auto

Mooney
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Re: New engine running too rich

Post by Mooney »

Ok so i've just cleaned all the spark plugs again, wound it out 2 more turns to make it 3 1/2 turns and it started after a few seconds cranking, then started spluttering and cut out within like 5 seconds. It just won't idle and even revving it, it starts to slow down, get lumpy and eventually cut out. 

Since the videos i stuck on here show the spark being orange, doesn't this lean towards a weak spark rather than too rich a mixture as both result in sooty plugs?
1983 1.9 DG WBX Automatic

ash1293
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Re: New engine running too rich

Post by ash1293 »

Don't get hung up on the colour of the plugs. Really to use the coour of plugs as a good indicator the van needs to be up and running at speed, once up to temp cut the engine mid drive, then you have a better idea.
As others have said the colour at the moment is going to be black as still on choke/idle when starting so will be richer at this point.

If you have access to a spare coil you could always try it, but I'd agree going back to basics, rest the idle screw and set the timing.
Check the carb is seated properly and gaskets don't look suspect.
1990 1.9DG 34DAT carb Leisuredrive hightop

Mooney
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Re: New engine running too rich

Post by Mooney »

I think i've gone through all the basics, and since it seemed to run perfectly 2 days ago but now wont i don't think it's a timing issue. The engine has just been reconned and i've put all new gaskets on everything and torqued to spec.

Timing, checked twice, following itchys guide exactly.

New air filter, new vac hoses, new brake vacuum hose. Dizzy advance tested and working.

Earths cleaned and refitted.

Fuel is pumping through fine.

Tested choke, carb heater, fuel cut off, all working.

New spark plugs, tested dizzy and working hall sensor.

Batteries are fully charged.

I've wound the idle speed screw in pretty far and it would rev highly for a few seconds before spluttering out.
1983 1.9 DG WBX Automatic

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DoubleOSeven
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New engine running too rich

Post by DoubleOSeven »

The black spark plugs suggest they are getting fuel, as you said. So it’s electrical. Coil is my guess, I have been here recently. they can be this erratic. Just double check the rotor arm and the ht lead is firmly placed home too. Oh and those two vacuum feeds that I always forget on back of carb. One from dizzy, one from air box. I think Brickwerks gave up on the Brosol, after a few failures.
1984 Caravelle 2.1 MV

Mooney
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Re: New engine running too rich

Post by Mooney »

I think i'm leaning towards ordering a new coil as i don't have the multimeter to test it otherwise. Yup new clean rotor arm solidly in place, ht leads on tight, dizzy cap on tight too. Dizzy vac feed is a new pipe, solidly on both ends, airbox to carb ends are both bunged off as apprently don't need in the British climate.

Any idea what the failures might have been on the Brosol?
1983 1.9 DG WBX Automatic

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DoubleOSeven
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Re: New engine running too rich

Post by DoubleOSeven »

Coil: 211905115D
1984 Caravelle 2.1 MV

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sarran1955
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Re: New engine running too rich

Post by sarran1955 »

Hello,

40 years ago the AA reported that 85% of petrol engine breakdowns were due to electrical problems.... :roll:

If you still have the old Hall effect DVDA distributor set up, 2 spigots on the capsule...

You can test by swapping in almost any transistor ignition coil, off a petrol polo etc..Borrow a friend's.. :?: :?:

It is worth checking the brown lead under the dizzy clamp....sometimes intermittant earth.... :wink:

If you do need a new coil, why not bite the bullet and fit an SVDA Powerspark dizzy and coil kit... no more shonky wiring loom.. :shock:

This video is for an air-cooled, but the principle remains the same..
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KkyBAMMHpa4&t=7s

Keep going...you will get there...and know your motor that bit better.... :)

Cordialement,

:ok
 
Help and advice on Aircooled engines here:
http://www.youtube.com/user/sarran1955/videos?view=0" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Mooney
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Joined: 18 Jan 2019, 17:05
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Location: Jersey

Re: New engine running too rich

Post by Mooney »

Hi,

I've cleaned and checked all grounds, especially the ones from the ignition amp and dizzy.

I've just ordered a new coil as well. I installed a new dizzy with hall effect sensor last year and it's given me no trouble really, just trying to get it to work on this new engine. I've done the hall sensor test and it works. 

Might consider a powerspark down the line if this keeps up tho.

Thanks
1983 1.9 DG WBX Automatic

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