SDI-ASY conversion

[jerrybus]

I have been thinking about transplanting an ASY 1.9 SDI engine into a JX engined bus. The JX is showing signs of terminal wear, eg excessive crank end float, oil leaks etc. I' going for the SDI as I've got a complete donor car. I've been reading many of the forums (fora?) about fitting 1Ys and more exotic motors and gather that the swap is pretty straightforward apart from the drive by wire pump and matching the loom to the bus. I would be more confident if I'd been able to find an ASY conversion. I'm not a complete novice and have tackled most jobs on T25s, but I am a bit daunted by the electrics issue. Any advice would be much appreciated. Cheers

[kevtherev]

I have been thinking about transplanting an ASY 1.9 SDI engine into a JX engined bus. The JX is showing signs of terminal wear, eg excessive crank end float, oil leaks etc. I' going for the SDI as I've got a complete donor car. I've been reading many of the forums (fora?) about fitting 1Ys and more exotic motors and gather that the swap is pretty straightforward apart from the drive by wire pump and matching the loom to the bus. I would be more confident if I'd been able to find an ASY conversion. I'm not a complete novice and have tackled most jobs on T25s, but I am a bit daunted by the electrics issue. Any advice would be much appreciated. Cheers

This bloke knows his plurals
Welcome in fella.

you must have missed the alternative engine forum on the index page.
this post will be moved there among its friends

[jerrybus]

Thank you Reverend, much appreciated given this is a busy time for men of the cloth...

[jes*b]

Hi. Welcome to the club. For your electrics / loom questions I thing syncroandy is your man ...

[xr219]

I think you would be dissapointed with the result,i have one of those engines in a caddy van its slow

[blueangel]

Hi and welcome to the club

Chris and Ken

[jerrybus]

Thanks blueangel, xr219 and jes*b and for your welcome and comments. I'm sure you're right xr219, my choice is based on the donor being a 'known' quantity and the SDIs reliability and economy versus the cost of going down the route of later VAG engines or a remanufactured JX/refurbished turbo. I'll just have to accept the 'performance' issue.

Latecomers like me are very fortunate to be able to read the 80-90ers and brickyarders detailed posts-I'm sure it's been said before but you lot are incredibly generous with your time and knowledge. I'll try 'syncroandy' as you suggest, jes*b.

Thanks again

[Walsanda]

I have just purchased a T25 1.6TD after more than 10 years of missing my last one which was wrecked when someone drove into the side of it. I hope you won't mind me using this thread to raise a similar problem I am having.

On its first outing, I achieved 60mph but felt reluctant to try any faster. The 1.6TD engine had an oil leak and I have had it looked at by a garage. It will cost £1200 to strip it down replace the seals and put it back together. It has recently had a reconditioned turbo fitted and some craft shaft work, before I bought it and the latter receipt notes that the crack shaft is worn. Sitting in my driveway is Skoda Fabia which is reaching the end of its useful life. It has a reasonably good 1.9 SDI ASY engine in it which has done 137k miles without a single breakdown, sits comfortably on the motorway at 70mph averaging 45-50mpg (gauge occasionally wobblies to 85). Most of the mileage has been done by either me or my wife and we do not thrash cars. My boy racer days ended when the T25 was new! I wondered whether I should use the Skoda engine (and gearbox?) to replace the 1.6TD engine before I get rid of the car as I think it will still achieve a comfortable 70mph on the motorway, rather than a top end 70mph from the 1.6TD. More importantly, I think the 1.9 SDI will be significantly more reliable and be able to lug the weight of my scuba gear more effectively than the 1.6TD. I would have to get a garage to do the work as I no longer have the time or inclination to get covered in oil again! Or at least not for a full engine rebuild/replacement.

I would appreciate any views on whether it is better to have the work done to the 1.6TD or replace it with the 1.9 SDI. Anyone any idea how much the latter is likely to cost, or whether there is a reliable company in Bristol to do the work?

[davegsm82]

Personally I wouldn't dream of fitting a 1.9 SDI in place of the 1.6JX for a couple of reasons.

1) the JX makes about 70HP if running right - The Fabia SDI makes about 67. Not a great difference, but...

2) You'd also have to find a suitable in-line (longitudingal, whatever) gearbox, as the engine is transverse in the fabia.

You couldn't re-use the JX gearbox effectively with this engine, as the JX produces it's power WAAAAY up in the rev-range.

The ASY SDI engine produces it's power (what little it has) a lot further down. so you'd be screaming it's nuts off way out of its comfortable rev-range just to keep the same speed as the JX would. I had an Octavia with the SDI engine and while it wasn't *entirely* dismal to drive, it wasn't a patch on the TDI in my golf. Also, just because it doesn't have a turbo doesn't automatically mean it's more efficient. You need to 'play to your audience', i.e. if you're doing lots of long trips, you don't want to be unnecessarily labouring an underpowered engine as it won't return good MPG.

I'm currently doing an AFN engine + DHL gearbox upgrade to my T25. That's going to take it to 110 BHP which is much more like the sort of power you need in a van like this to at least get to and hold 70 comfortably.

Basically, if you're going to go to the trouble of doing a conversion, do it properly with a 1.9TDI. They are not hard to get running, as per my own thread here ---> http://forum.club8090.co.uk/viewtopic.php?f=12&t=141442 also, with you being in bristol, you're perfectly suited to go and see Tim at Ultimate engineering. He just so happens to make the parts for fitting the 1.9TDI engines (I think he also offers a fitting service but I could be wrong).

Dave.

[Walsanda]

Dave,

Many thanks for the frank response. I had been wavering on the conversion anyway so I will now have a conversation with Tim before getting the 1.6TD refurbished - hopefully it just needs a strip down and the oil seals replaced - engine runs fine but it leaks oil everywhere.

[davegsm82]

No problem at all Walsanda.

I hope you get sorted ok

Where is the JX leaking from? if it's the crank seals then they will be problematic, but not impossible to do yourself if you're so inclined.

Dave.

[jerrybus]

Hi Dave

I read your replies to walsanda and wondered if, as the ASYs power comes in lower down, would it actually be less likely to warrant revving for the same result, or am I simply misunderstanding the engine/gear ratio interaction. I take your point about the engines limited power, but it's supposed to be a match for the JX in torque. Walsandas comment about having a 'known', effectively free donor might still be a point in it's undoubtably rather pedestrian appeal? By the way, I don't doubt the advice about using a TDI, I just wish I could afford one!

[davegsm82]

Hey jerrybus,

I think you might well be misunderstanding the interaction, if you mate the ASY to the JX gearbox then your ASY engine will still do the same RPM for any given speed. So if you were doing 3kRPM to do 55mph you would still be doing the same with the new engine.

If however you were to 're-gear' the final drive of the JX's gearbox then you would be able to take greater advantage of the ASYs output. From what I remember the ASY has a relatively flat torque curve, meaning that you could actually still achieve your 55mph but with the engine trundling along at say, 2.5k RPM.

Even if the engine was a known quantity and essentially free, I still wouldn't do it. You have to consider that changing it will put the vehicle into a 'modified' category, that means an insurance hike usually so you want to be getting something worthwhile for your troubles.

I paid 250 quid for the correct engine with ancillaries, loom, clocks etc from a sharan and a box from an a4. You could probably sell the fabia and buy the bits for that, also remember that there's a fair bit of fabrication/adaptation of the new electrics, engine and box just to make it move, so again, if going to that trouble I would advise a 110 turbo engine.

Hope this helps

Dave.

[jerrybus]

Thanks Dave, I suppose if ASYs were a good alternative someone would have done one by now and sung it's praises...back to the drawing board...

[davegsm82]

No problem matey, not wanting to 'pi$$ on' anyone's bonfire at all, just would be a shame to see someone sink a load of money into an engine which then throws a rod because it wasn't meant to rev so highly for so long.

When I get mine done I will happily invite anyone who's interested (and local) for a ride along to see the results

Dave.